Spasms vs Spasticity

[teesieme]

In a post by dgrotz about Spasms,and baclofen the difference between these two has been explained...yet

If, for the most part my son feels the need to stretch his legs and does, thus resulting in a spasm and then minimally spasticity I guess, if he doesn't stretch them, I am asking what other type of med would perhaps be a choice instead of baclofen?

Dr. Young you stated that "baclofen in high doses will result in flaccidity (no muscle activation)", prior word/advice from some was that it had taken away muscle usage that would be there otherwise to them also...(p.s. my son takes three 20 mgs. a day)


[This message was edited by teesieme on 05-20-04 at 10:24 PM.]

[This message was edited by teesieme on 05-20-04 at 10:26 PM.]

[This message was edited by teesieme on 05-21-04 at 10:06 AM.]

[teesieme]

Alright, 58 views, I have edited my post three times now and am worrying I have yet again made a fool out of myself?! I am good at that though!

[This message was edited by teesieme on 05-21-04 at 11:49 AM.]

[maryonwheels46]

I ask some similar questions in the spasm post.

[teesieme]

Hi Mary

I peeked and yes, we seem to be wondering the same things.

I didn't want to hi-jack the dgrotz's post with the way I can go on and on...thus my editing little by little by little.

I do know in the past when I have asked about baclofen side effects sexually and B & B, I found out it isn't for the bladder after all. Okay...now if it isn't the right medication for his spasm/spasticity he has then... again. I know it helps many people but if it isn't helping in the right ways or correct ways for each individual, hmmm, sure seems to be a common prescription given from what I have seen and learned so far.

Spasms/spasticity can be dangerous as the nurse stated, but I just want my son to be on medications that are for his own specifics and needs without taking away from him too.

[woman from Europe]

I am not sure I understand what you want to say, you know I am a foreigner and stupid some times . But I have tried to eat Baclofen and I stopped because my knees got shaky and I had a hard time walking. So I am using my spasticity to walk.

And I was eating 5mgx3. With 20mgx3 I am sure I would have been unable to walk.

TH 12 incomplete 12-12-69. I am still a walker but I do not know for how long time.

[dogger]

Teesieme , i'm sorry , but i don't understand this statement ,
Quote''If, for the most part my son feels the need to stretch his legs and does, thus resulting in a spasm and then minimally spasticity I guess, if he doesn't stretch them, I am asking what other type of med would perhaps be a choice instead of baclofen?'' Unquote .
are you saying that if he does stretches , then spasms/spasticity cease to be be a problem ? if this is the case i would suggest more stretches less drugs . i'll relate my experience with anti spasticity drugs . i am a '' walker ''. i never tried any drugs until about one year post . one day while servicing a tractor i had a spasm that pulled my legs up against my chest and left me hanging about 4 feet off the ground by my arms . after a couple of minutes the spasm relaxed , allowing me to put my feet back on the platform i had been standing on , but it was an interesting few minutes as i hung there wondering if my quad arms would keep their grip on what they were clutched around [ though a look down at the bits of machinery i would probably fall on gave some incentive to hold on ] . after a discussion with my local Doctor i tried anti spasmatic drugs . i think all told i tried about 6 or 8 different drugs at various intakes . i'm sorry , i can't remember the names of any others apart from baclofen [ this was 12 years ago ] , but they all caused diminishing motor function in muscles below my lesion level if taken in high enough doses to give any effect on spasm/spasticity . this was enough to make some every day tasks that were normally not a problem , almost impossible . i decided to live with my spasms/spasticity . as an aside , drinking alcohol has a very similar effect on my function as baclofen etc . sorry for being so long winded , i guess what i basically have said , is ,yes there is a choice of different drugs and , yes , i found the ones i tried affected function .
thank you ,
dogger

every day i wake up is a good one .

[SCI-Nurse]

Woman, you are not stupid. This is an excellent point, as many people who are incomplete depend upon a certain degree of spasticity to maintain their gait stability. If these meds are adjusted too high, you can become more disabled. Fine tuning is needed to find the right drug, right dose, or right combination that keeps the spasticity from interfering with ambulation, but does not also make you so weak or flaccid that you cannot ambulate either.

(KLD)

[teesieme]

TY for your replies. Nurse, I chuckled at your opening sentence when I realized, Woman and Woman from Europe. LOL.

In answer to my statement of my son feeling the need to stretch his legs, he read this and stated that yes, it is just every so often that outside stimulation (touch of feet at times but mainly things like an ingrown toenail rubbing, or the hamstring problem he was having), that movement or stance in leg braces may bring about spasm/spasticity, but he knows it just before it happens. In reading this, for him to validate things I write, I have to let you know, that Harry says it is like when a girl comes to sit on his lap and he hasn't stretched his legs out for awhile then he gets a spasm/spasticity
BTW, I am having a hard time keeping the meaning of and the words together correctly.

In my first unedited post I had stated that although he can't wiggle his toes, etc. he can move his legs sideways in and out in the swimming pool somewhat and there are other things that happen subconsiously for him too but he doesn't realize he does them, like lifting his booty up and off to the side to stretch while yapping on the cell phone when I am driving and not using anything for support in doing so. There are many other things that happen in ways that just can't be a spasm/spasticity I wonder about. And this is why, I really appreciate learning all I can about this because maybe the med has been holding him back once his body adjusted and has been healing???
It will be up to him of course the change of meds or not taking them, I know as much as he works at keeping what he has with return and hoping to gain, he worries about getting hurt from a spasm/spasticity too, as for the first six months or so, they were quite scary a few times.
So thank you for the information, for sharing and if anyone can give me an idea of what he should perhaps try instead after weaning off of baclofen and finding he does need something after all, I would truly appreciate it.

Whew, I am long winded too Dogger! TY again everyone!!!

[woman from Europe]

I am taking Rivotril 1,5 mg every night. Rivotril is clonazepam, I do not know if you have it. It is a medication for epilepsi, not like Neurontin but different.

But maybe the nurse can tell us if Rivotril is making people weak too, I sometimes wonder. I take it for pain not for spasticity. If I don't take it, the pain is killing me. With Rivotril I am without pain most of the time.

TH 12 incomplete 12-12-69. I am still a walker but I do not know for how long time.

[SCI-Nurse]

Clonazepam is sometimes used for spasticity in the USA also. It is chemically related to Valium and is primarily a sedative, but is also used sometimes for neuropathic pain or spasticity. Like Valium though it causes physical dependence and can make depression worse.

(KLD)