18x18 85 Degree TiLite ZRc (The Z9.5)

[SCI_OTR]

Now that I've had the opportunity to poke some fun at the over-priced Z10 Limited Edition, here's an awesome looking chair that will never get the chance to be a collectible. I'm calling it the "Z9.5" because it's not quite a Z10 (it's pretty close) and it is arguably the sharpest looking chair I've done...







Pretty pictures aside, the main reason I post many of the highly customized chairs I do on CareCure is to help end users who are getting a new chair for themselves. Not only do I try to provide specs, I try to share any lessons learned in the process. With that in mind, let's start with the specs:

TiLite ZRc
- Polished Frame (Veterans who are full-time wheelchair users do get their choice of color)
- 85 Degree Front Frame Angle
- C Package with Tapered Seat AND V-Front End
- 18" Rear Seat Width with 1.5" of Seat Taper
- 10.5" Footrest Spacing
- Frog Legs Suspension Forks
- 4" Volcanic Light Up Casters
- STF Heights: 21"F/18"R
- Seat To Footrest (Spec): 17"
- Seat To Footrest (Actual): 18.5"
- Center of Gravity: 4.5"
- .75" Wheel Spacing
- 4 Deg Camber
- 26x1" Spinergy LX Wheels/Kenda Kontender Tires
- Natural Fit Handrims
- Fold Down Carbon Fiber Rigid Side Guards--Standard

Cleveland VA Functional Upgrade Package:

- 10"H JetStream Pro Low Back with Fixed Hardware
- Quickie Ergo Scissor Locks
- Custom ABS Footrest Cover with 1/4" Build-Up on Right Half

While an 18" seat depth and no custom frame length were spec'd, this chair has Frog Legs suspension forks. As a result the bend starts an inch in front of the upholstery...



The veteran (who happens to be a CareCure member) has a leg length discrepancy. I fabricated a custom footplate cover similar to the one used on my ZRc to provide better positioning of each foot on the footrest. His was the first I fabricated for a veteran, but I will soon begin fabricating another for a veteran who will be getting a TRc.



The chair was ordered with the narrowest wheel spacing possible (.75") for 4 degrees of camber. Even so, with the ZRs's 18" seat width, 26" diameter wheels, and rear wheel camber, overall width is about 28". While this would no doubt cause accessibility issues for many, he has an older ZRc with identical specs and has been able to live with it. Still, given the spoke clearance with the side guards, brackets, and backrest hardware, it would be theoretically possible to reduce the overall width another 1/4-1/2".

This is the first chair I've done which has both frame options available with the "C Package"--a tapered seat as well as the V-front end. Not knowing how to obtain accurate specs when ordering the C-package can result in a poorly fitting chair. It is easy to confuse a tapered front end, a tapered seat, and a V-front end. It can also be confusing determining whether to measure the inner or outer distance between the 1.25" diameter frame tubing. I may not do another tapered seat for some time, so this chair is a good opportunity to show a real world example of these options.

Here is what was spec'd on the order form...


Note that in TiLite-speak, a tapered seat which is 4" narrower than seat width refers to the inside distance between the seat tubing. Rear seat width is an outside measurement while front seat width is an inside measurement. I have no idea why they do this, because most people think the front seat width is going to be 4" less than the rear seat width.

Here's how those specs translate to the actual chair...



Maybe it's just me, but wouldn't it make more sense to describe this chair as having tapered seat with a rear seat width of 18" and a front seat width of 16.5"?

Determining COG can also be confusing since it implies one needs measure between two hypothetical points in space. Per the order form...

Measure from front of back post at the seat tube to the center of the rear axle.

I can not guarantee with absolute certainty that this always works, but based on a couple of recent ZR's I've ordered, it appears a good rule of thumb for COG may be to measure the distance from the back side of the large bolt on the frame for the backrest latch to the middle of the vertical stem for the camber tube mount.




Mark Westphal at TiLite helped me solve a significant problem I encountered after I installed the JetStream Pro back on the chair. It turned out that the standard size fold down CF side guards would not fold down because the JetStream was in the way. Although TiLite charges $360 for a Designs Unlimited special to custom cut side guards, he arranged for me to send them back and be notched free of charge...



No manufacturer is perfect, but this is a great chair and I considered that to be excellent customer service.

Just in time for delivery before Christmas.

[smokey]

"Santa Baby slip a TiLite under the tree for me".........those seat dimensions would accomodate my ass. Looks very cool too. I need about 20" STF in the front and 17" STF in the back. Maybe 26" Spinergys with a Kik solid tire. I've been a very good boy this year.....so far.

[SCI_OTR]

Remaining pics which could not be uploaded to the CC server in the original post...

[Antonio]

[QUOTE=SCI_OTR;1137526]Maybe it's just me, but wouldn't it make more sense to describe this chair as having tapered seat with a rear seat width of 18" and a front seat width of 16.5"?

I agree. It would be much clearer. BTW: who can benefit from a tapered seat? People with wide pelvis and thin limbs?


[QUOTE=SCI_OTR;1137526]Determining COG can also be confusing since it implies one needs measure between two hypothetical points in space.

Are there other measurements that allow to make a (not perfect, OK) comparison among the balance of different chairs?.

Thanks for the info!

[totoL1]

[QUOTE=Antonio;1138042]

Originally Posted by SCI_OTR

I agree. It would be much clearer. BTW: who can benefit from a tapered seat? People with wide pelvis and thin limbs?

Me for example, i never thought in a tapared seat before i tried the Panthera, and after try it i will go for one, it was much confortable than my chair with 16" front seat, you`ve got a fealling like if you are sitting in a sit of a sport car, you feel like the chair envelops you and you have your legs always in the perfect position.

Of course it`s not recommended for everyone, because you will have more risk of skinsore, but for me it`s not a problem because i`ve got sensibility.

So i recommended seat tapered for all people who have got incomplete SCI and they can move a bit their legs or have some sensibility.

[amyk]

i have a tapered seat on my zr (front inside width 10") and i really like it as my legs stay in position. my current cushion is a varilite zoid and its front width is only a tiny bit bigger than my outside width, hardly noticeable.

[totoL1]

Originally Posted by amyk

my current cushion is a varilite zoid and its front width is only a tiny bit bigger than my outside width, hardly noticeable.

You don`t have that problem in Pantheras, because they start the tapered front where the seat depth finish, but i really don`t know yet what chair i`m going to buy, but if in the order form of any chair i`ve got it for an option, i will take it.

[wheelboy]

i think it has its pros and conns .i have a 4 inch taper also .pros are keeps my legs in position eazier also fits eazier in the front of my car (i have a fiat panda) i think it looks better also .the bad thing is in the winter when de frame is cold my legs get cold 2 .but with the new orderd zr i have let them put frame protectors on it i hope this solves that problem for a bit

[SCI_OTR]

totoL1,

By its very nature, the tapered seat is designed to become narrower before the end of the upholstery.

The tapered seat has been marketed by at least one manufacturer as a way to "allow the front of the seat to be narrower like your body, virtually making the chair
disappear". Yeah right.

I think its best application may be for women--who tend to have proportionately wider hips than men. They are also more likely to be self-conscience about their legs being positioned "ala fuente" when they sit in a wheelchair.

The downside of getting more than 1.5" of seat taper is that a custom cushion/cover may become necessary and wheel locks become less effective because they must span a greater distance between the frame and the tire. The wheel lock will also wear out more quickly because the fasteners and pivot points are subject to much greater stress.

The veteran who will be picking up this chair tomorrow currently has a similar ZRc with 2.5" of taper. When we did the specs we compromised on 1.5" for the reasons I just mentioned.

[SCI_OTR]

Lets make sure everyone is talking about the same things here...