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Thread: iMac vs. PC?

  1. #81
    Senior Member CapnGimp's Avatar
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    http://www.dummies.com/how-to/conten...h-airport.html

    If you get time, read this. REBOOTING the stuff clears any problems you may have.
    Turn off all puters and unplug(power) the modem and router for 15 secs.
    Then plug in the modem and WAIT UNTIL IT HAS a connection to the internet.
    THEN plug in your router. You can bring your devices up now.

    I'm assuming your troubles come from lack of understanding what is going on with each of these...

    Modem-FIRST device in the chain. This allows you to connect to the internet, it's the main piece, lol.
    Some of them contain a router, others don't...

    Router- used to assign IP addresses (LAN ip) to multiple computers wanting internet access from one location(one WAN ip) It can(SHOULD) use NAT( Network Address Translation ) to hide your computers from the outside world. THIS is your PRIMARY line of defense from those who attempt to takeover/otherwise subvert your computer. It assigns internal network addresses to ur devices and routes info to and from them....it SEPARATES the info according to which device requested/sent it.
    192.168.x.x, 172.16.x.x
    172.31.x.x, and 10.x.x.x
    this will be the range for ips inside your network

    liken it to an apt complex where the mailman tosses EVERYone's mail into a big pile, then a ROUTER comes along and assigns apartment numbers so everyone gets their mail. An ip address is a mailbox number for an individual computer
    but the WAN ip is erased and a LAN ip is written on the envelope

    AIRPORT(the base actually) does all this also THIS is where your problem is originating
    You only want/need ONE router assigning INTERNAL (lan) ips.
    Airport is wireless, as you now know and understand, and if you are WIRED to the network already, you don't want to coRnfuse the modem with two routers.

    For the record, you can use multiple routers(big betworks) but each will have a differing and increasing METRIC. don't concern yourself with this I put it here for the peckerheads who will shout it out if I leave it out(trying to show ya how smart they are, yet not attempting to help ya til now lol)


    WAN- the ip assigned address for YOUR paid internet connection... it does NOT take into account how many computers or how they connect...it is up to you.

    LAN- Local Area Network-- all the puters/devices at your home
    this includes phones that can connect to the internet

    I meant this to help you, if I left something out or need to clarify something... holler they have ya taken care of, I just wanted you to know WHY it works like this. That way you can help others later on.
    Last edited by CapnGimp; 03-28-2010 at 03:28 PM.

  2. #82
    Senior Member CapnGimp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RehabRhino View Post
    Can't help with your router issues but Google Chrome for Mac is a way better browser than Safari. Faster and cleaner
    Using OPERA since 1997. I've been browsing expertly all the while everyone else wasn't. Actually dunno if it has a MAC port as I never intend to buy a MAC. I can build my puters cheaper.

    The last OPERA update put a new engine in, I be liking it too.

  3. #83
    Senior Member Scorpion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RehabRhino View Post
    Can't help with your router issues but Google Chrome for Mac is a way better browser than Safari. Faster and cleaner
    I didn't realize they had a Mac version out. I want to try it.

  4. #84
    Senior Member mr_coffee's Avatar
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    I just got a sweet MacBook pro from work and all i can say is WOWOWOWO. Totally dominates PC's but I wouldn't ever buy a mac because I can't play my computer games on it. But if work is going to give me one for free i'll take it and love it.
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  5. #85
    Senior Member zagam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunwawry View Post
    Actually, that is no longer true. Macs have now gained sufficient popularity that they have also become targets for malware. It is recommended that you have an antivirus program and keep it up to date.
    No, it not popularity is design that Microsoft viruses exploit. If it has not been designed to run viruses then it will not. After all it is only a machine. Now that Apple have ditched flash I can not see how a virus could exploit a Mac. For a long time that have not had Acrobat Reader.

    Can some explain how a virus on Mac could be possible. Biologists may weigh in if they want.

    If not then the Microsoft popularity myth is just that, a myth.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Flash#Security
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Flash#Stability
    http://www.apple.com/hotnews/thoughts-on-flash/

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by zagam View Post
    No, it not popularity is design that Microsoft viruses exploit. If it has not been designed to run viruses then it will not. After all it is only a machine. Now that Apple have ditched flash I can not see how a virus could exploit a Mac. For a long time that have not had Acrobat Reader.

    Can some explain how a virus on Mac could be possible. Biologists may weigh in if they want.

    If not then the Microsoft popularity myth is just that, a myth.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Flash#Security
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Flash#Stability
    http://www.apple.com/hotnews/thoughts-on-flash/
    Not a myth, and no Apple's still have not become popular enough for people to waste their time trying to exploit it. Do you think Flash is the only way people get viruses on their PC? They also get them from opening emails with attachments, from downloading from emails, from downloading from websites, from not having firewalls set appropriately...etc. So many ways other then just through flash.

    From the last I've heard there are still less then 10% of computer users with a Apple. So if you are writing harmful code to infect others computers why would you waste your time on something that would effect less then 10% of the computer users in the world. You wouldn't and they don't.

    As for which is better, it's a personal opinion and everyone has one. I worked for Apple from Nov 08 to Jan of this year and used their newest computers every day. It would lock up and/or shut off on it's own often, so yea it's not the MS blue screen, but it's just the same, gotta restart it to get back in it. Was it easier to use? I never thought it was, I have of course used every Windows since 95, but I didn't see what about it would have been more intuitive if I hadn't.

    If anything is Hype, it's the Apple hype machine. For the same price I can build a desktop that is 3x the machine I'd buy from Apple. I just don't see the benefit.

    In all honesty I think within 5 years Apple might decide to give up on the computer market. They have their iPad, iPhone, iPods, iTunes...etc. Those make them much more money then their computers do, I believe that in the future that will be all that they do.

  7. #87
    Senior Member zagam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasWheelz View Post
    Do you think Flash is the only way people get viruses on their PC?
    No, there are many other ways on a PC.

    I am a GNU/Linux user. I also have Solaris, AIX, Minix and Mac is my zoo. I plan to move beyond Unix to Plan9 soon. I decided to move our corporate desktop beyond MS-DOS and Windows last century because of the intractable security issues. We did not go for Apple, we got SunRay as cost was important in changing out the 100s of desktops in a very short time.

    I also keep some Microsoft from time to time in some torture chambers. These are disposable virtual machines with only virtual networking. This is the only responsible way to use Microsoft and its viruses.

    Turing complete scripting environments that run remote scripts are just one back door. In Unix the harm they can do is limited if they do not support setuid. It is actually memory management hardware that enforces this security model.

    On Mac the remaining threats are Java and 3rd party software installed by admin user such as Adobe. Not only do these need to be limited to user that running them, but they also need to be limited to a window pane otherwise they can take over the desktop and do anything as the user.

    If a GUI program goes bad you can then take the focus off the window and use the window manager to delete its window. This is often needed with careless, reckless or malicious flash sites. (X11R4 rather than Mac terminology.) If the whole desktop were compromised you would have to login remotely via SSH and then kill the insecure adobe flash player. (There are free flash players available that are more secure, but they are not well supported by flash sites.)

    As MacOS X is based on Unix, but not Unix it may have some vulnerabilities just as a badly administered Unix system would have, however if it is compromised then all Apple have to do is go to the Unix security model and they will not break any correct Unix application when they fix problem.

    A Microsoft PC with an Internet connection must remain public access because if they close the back doors they will break many applications. There is no such thing as a correct Microsoft program.

    The problem is Microsoft put these back doors in there in first place and now they can not remove them.

    Some Australian mining company execs are doing hard time in a Chinese prison thanks to an MS autorun.inf file on a USB stick left in a hotel room thanks to back door Billy. Sony also used the MS autorun.inf on music CDs to infect MS machines when their CDs were played. I have demonstrated many remote by the wire attacks too. Outhouse/Outbreak, Idiot Exploiter, RPC to name a few. It was remote by the wire attack in 1999 prompted the desktop change out.

    Computers viruses are now only of historical interest. Most of them pre-date Unix. What we have now are more correctly known as Microsoft viruses.

    The term Microsoft virus is in common usage in Qmail circles. Qmail was a simple scalable MTA, but this simplicity was broken by then need to check for Microsoft viruses and mitigate their other effects at SMTP time.

  8. #88
    Senior Member zagam's Avatar
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    Microsoft fingers

    Quote Originally Posted by TexasWheelz View Post
    From the last I've heard there are still less then 10% of computer users with a Apple. So if you are writing harmful code to infect others computers why would you waste your time on something that would effect less then 10% of the computer users in the world. You wouldn't and they don't.
    This makes no sense given the way a lot of harmful code operates, yet Microsoft still spout this themselves. When Microsoft continues to use this excuse when the problem is 100% their fault they just look plain dumb.

    Some harmful code requires luser with admin rights to install it. This could effect other systems as sooner or later they will find some one stupid enough to install the Trojan.

    You may have heard of Cobol fingers where fingers are ground down to stumps.

    I am going to define a new term "Microsoft fingers".

    Microsoft fingers are when you blame everyone else for defects in your software.

    Microsoft fingers <insert anything, but Microsoft here>.

  9. #89
    I don't understand how that doesn't make sense, if you want to effect as many people as possible with something but know you aren't going to be able to effect them all, then you start with what ever gives you the largest chance. If only 1% of windows users were to get infected then that would still be more users then if all of Apple computer users were infected.

    You are right, MS should have it all taken care of themselves by now, you are also right that most harmful code has to have some input by the user before it can infect their machine. But there are still a majority of computer users(from what I've experience as a tech support specialist on and off for 10 years) who have no idea what they are doing other then opening email or going to a website from a link sent to them.

    I continually help supposed tech savvy users with their computers and the majority of them haven't ran MS update ever, which of course leaves them more open to exploits then if if they had ran it and closed them.

    My parents and brothers have had computers since '95, yet I still have to wipe their hard drives once a year because they've screwed stuff up so bad by downloading crap they shouldn't be. Personally though I have never had a virus/mal-ware/ad-ware...infected computer and have always used Windows machines at home other then one old ass pc with Ubuntu for file storage.

    They could get a Apple and not have to worry about it, but they would pay 2-3 times for the same computer, and regardless of what anyone says they can open their email and website as easy on a PC as they ever could on a Apple. That's all the majority of people use them for, so when I hear that a Apple is easier to use and more intuitive then a PC I just laugh. With both you can have them set to 1 click and open up whatever ya want on a bar that runs across the top, side or bottom of your screen. With them both you click a X in the corner and close the program. So with just a bit of security(I've used free AVG antivirus for about 7 years now) and some common sense you aren't likely to get infected on a PC.

  10. #90
    Senior Member zagam's Avatar
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    We got ridden hard in 1999 by back door Billy. This effected many users. Spent Christmas and new year examining attack by packet sniffing looking at running code in VMs. It turned out to be a component of MS Office 97 using msn.com.au (our CCTLD) to attack the Messenger component of Netscape Communicator. Netscape was used as it was trivial to confuse OutHouse/OutBreak/OutLook about content so that it would apply the check for plain text and then run as binary to view that "plain text". We could not blame the lusers for this. Played remote beer and skittles with my Windows droid developer cousin on the ER Mapper test environment. I knocked them down with different remotes as fast as he could re-build them. Still have the email from an ER Mapper director confirming that this cracking activity was okay. I took great care to trash only the test environment and not the native development environment.

    As it was the devil I knew it became the basis for SOE after some heavy patching.

    Our legacy SOE is Windows XP Pro since the browser war died down, previous one was custom Windows 95 installer made on GNU/Linux used since '99 and some still in service. Idiot Exploiter was not integrated and OutHouse/OutBreak/OutLook Express was not included. The killer app Microsoft Office '97 was not installed with Outlook or anything that depended on it.

    We could protect this using content filters email. Netscape Communicator email client will not protect lusers with admin rights. To protect browser squid which filters URLs only would suffice. This was basically clean, but installing separate Win98 type components for apps became a chore.

    Grabbing Win7 from technet. Will see if it runs in Bootcamp. The Debian netinst didn't. Will try native EFI using full Debian install. Still need Bootcamp to re-size MacOS X partitions. Like my Power Macs better. They make an excellent Linux platform. So do Sun UltraSPARC Ts.

    Our desktop is now Unix+X11R4 via SunRay so we are top 1% not 10%!

    This is the 3rd option for a user desktop and runs under BIOS on PeeCee hardware. For those who are chicken can play with live discs before putting it on the hard disc. I run Debian GNU/Linux on my desktops. May try Plan9 to go beyond a Unix knock off. (Unix ideas not SCO's non-viewable remains.)

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