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Thread: a cure ?when and by who?

  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by Mize View Post
    Assisted waking isn't a cure and I'd argue almost anyone doing the intensive gait training would improve. By bladder and bowel, you mean the ability to self-manage your own bladder and bowel program, not that you won't need to cath or use digital stimulation to relieve yourself.
    I did not say it was a cure, it is substantial progress.

    A separate study is being done at Tongren Hospital in China without cells, only walking training (WT) or WT + untethering surgery. Preliminary results show 1/4 of subjects are regaining the ability to ambulate, but not nearly as well as in the ChinaSCINet Phase II. None regained bowel/bladder function. Most of the participants in Phase II went from being dependent for bowel/bladder care, to independent. Many no longer need to cath or do digital stimulation. This will all be analyzed much more closely in the IIb trials.
    Bowel and bladder didn't come back until a year after treatment which suggests regeneration, as well the DTI images showing growth.

  2. #82
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    Thanks for clarifying Jim. As a scientist I try to restrain my optimism in spite of desperately wanting to walk again. I am very hopeful your research will lead to improvements. If it seems I am not it's likely just the skeptic wanting to temper expectations so as not to be too disappointed.
    T3 complete since Sept 2015.

  3. #83

  4. #84
    Thanks Grammy, I missed when that video was posted. I know each study has to create a baseline for what results they can get independently, but I would love to see this combined with Dr. Wise's stem cell treatment.

  5. #85
    Senior Member lunasicc42's Avatar
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    hey nphuskers, whats your level of injury and how long have you been injured?
    "That's not smog! It's SMUG!! " - randy marsh, southpark

    "what???? , you don't 'all' wear a poop sac?.... DAMNIT BONNIE, YOU LIED TO ME ABOUT THE POOP SAC!!!! "


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  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    I did not say it was a cure, it is substantial progress.

    Most of the participants in Phase II went from being dependent for bowel/bladder care, to independent. Many no longer need to cath or do digital stimulation. This will all be analyzed much more closely in the IIb trials.
    Bowel and bladder didn't come back until a year after treatment which suggests regeneration, as well the DTI images showing growth.
    If the patients switched to just wearing diapers, they could say after treatment that they no longer cath or digital stimulation. Those are very ambiguous terms that can mean very different things. Can the completely injured patients feel that their bladder is full? Not dysreflexia feeling, but normal able-bodied sensation of full bladder. Can the patients control the bladder sphincter? Can they hold in the urine and void via their own brain command? The same goes for bowel function.

    If they cannot be answered, I don't think its fair to publicly say that bowel and bladder came back or that they no longer need to cath. That gives off the impression that patients recovered bowel/bladder connections from the brain to bowel/bladder.

  7. #87
    Many unanswered questions...
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  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Nowhere Man View Post
    If the patients switched to just wearing diapers, they could say after treatment that they no longer cath or digital stimulation. Those are very ambiguous terms that can mean very different things. Can the completely injured patients feel that their bladder is full? Not dysreflexia feeling, but normal able-bodied sensation of full bladder. Can the patients control the bladder sphincter? Can they hold in the urine and void via their own brain command? The same goes for bowel function.

    If they cannot be answered, I don't think its fair to publicly say that bowel and bladder came back or that they no longer need to cath. That gives off the impression that patients recovered bowel/bladder connections from the brain to bowel/bladder.
    Very fair and precise criticism. Shows just how fucked and far from a "fix" we really are

  9. #89
    Junior Member lampros's Avatar
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    What s going on here? Is anybody to answer in these basic question? or to give an exactly scientifical description about the results and solve these bewilderment?

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by lampros View Post
    What s going on here? Is anybody to answer in these basic question? or to give an exactly scientifical description about the results and solve these bewilderment?
    I don't think anyone knows until we get the data from Phase 3 trials which contain large numbers of participants. There's so many variables that need to be acknowledged. Here's a pretty nice list of SCI trials currently underway.

    https://www.u2fp.org/educate/clinical-trials/

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