Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 45

Thread: Hoyer Advance 340 lift

  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by HACKNSACK44 View Post
    I've had the lift for around 3 years. I had the batteries replaced once. My fault I didn't keep the lift plugged in when it wasn't being used. Big no no.
    I think the question is: "How long can you leave the lift plugged in and UNUSED before the batteries won't cut the mustard." Unless you expect "emergencies" to be relatively common...

  2. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Saint Petersburg , Florida
    Posts
    906
    Quote Originally Posted by automation View Post
    I think the question is: "How long can you leave the lift plugged in and UNUSED before the batteries won't cut the mustard." Unless you expect "emergencies" to be relatively common...
    The only way I will know is when it doesn't work. Unfortunately then I'm screwed until I can get the batteries replaced.

  3. #13
    Hack, Do you use your on a regular basis?

    automation, I like the thought of the electric but not sure it makes sense to spend the extra money and constantly maintain the batteries for something I might not use for months or years. I can find a simple manual lift that's used for @ $200. I really want the Hoyer Advance compact portable (don't know where id store a regular lift) but they're $1,400 new. Haven't found any used manual ones, found a couple of the portable electric. But by the time you add shipping your talking @ $1,200 - $1,500 and then you have to maintain the batteries.


    I'll be 65 this month and not sure how much longer I'll be living independently, hoping 2-5 years. Maybe I should just get a cheap manual lift, stick it in my small side yard and throw a tarp over it, till the time comes I'll need one on a regular basis. Getting old sucks but so does the alternative.

    Thanks for the replies.

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by HACKNSACK44 View Post
    The only way I will know is when it doesn't work. Unfortunately then I'm screwed until I can get the batteries replaced.
    The problem with all battery systems (battery powered devices) is matching the actual usage with the usage patterns for which the system was designed.

    For example, battery powered tools are designed for rapid recharge -- because a "worker" doesn't want to have to wait around for a battery to charge (so, you'd like the battery to charge in the time that your "spare" takes to "run down").

    I have lots of UPSs, here. We rarely have outages so the need for the batteries is very "occasional". And, when there is an outage, it is often brief (lights flickering, etc.). Even if it is extended, I can arrange to shut down the computer promptly. So, I can tolerate batteries having "reduced capacity".

    I'd prefer the UPSs to treat the batteries very gently -- with a goal towards maximizing their useful life. But, the UPS designers want the batteries to be recharged quickly (to protect against any OTHER outages). And, they are in the business of selling batteries so the idea of making the batteries last longer just doesn't fit with their mindsets!

    If you're designing a lift, you are probably assuming it sees daily usage. So, you want the batteries to "always" appear to be fully charged. You probably DON'T plan on a lift sitting in the corner, on its charger, WAITING to be used at some future date. As a result, you design the battery pack and charger for the "regular usage" case -- at the expense of the "maximal lifespan".

    [I hate batteries -- because they "always" need replacing when you need them! (how often do you notice the batteries in your flashlight are dead when you AREN'T USING the flashlight?! ]

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by wes4dbt View Post
    I like the thought of the electric but not sure it makes sense to spend the extra money and constantly maintain the batteries for something I might not use for months or years.
    Understood. I refurbished a little 3-wheel "scooter" for a woman, here. She had to buy new batteries. I wonder how often she actually uses it (as she doesn't have a lift on her vehicle so any use will be around the house or rely on a helpful neighbor to load it into her trunk)

    I can find a simple manual lift that's used for @ $200. I really want the Hoyer Advance compact portable (don't know where id store a regular lift) but they're $1,400 new. Haven't found any used manual ones, found a couple of the portable electric. But by the time you add shipping your talking @ $1,200 - $1,500 and then you have to maintain the batteries.
    One of the problems with DME is that it tends to be large/bulky --> expensive to ship! So, if you can't find it locally, the potential savings (used) are easily offset by the cost of getting it delivered.

    Check to see if there are any local organizations that refurbish donated/surplus kit. Or, that maintain a DME "lending library".

    Finding these places/people is often tricky. But, I have been chagrined at how much "stuff" ends up headed towards the landfill! Of course, you don't really have the range of selections that you'd get "at retail" as you're relying on someone discarding/outgrowing their kit and bringing it to such a place.

    I'll be 65 this month...
    Happy Birthday!

    and not sure how much longer I'll be living independently, hoping 2-5 years. Maybe I should just get a cheap manual lift, stick it in my small side yard and throw a tarp over it, till the time comes I'll need one on a regular basis.
    How accessible would it be, for you, there? If it's going to be a PITA to use, then is it really worth the effort? Similarly, will any "assisted living" facility that you end up in have room to accommodate it? (or, would you rely on them providing whatever you needed?)

    I tend to take a practical outlook on these things. I'm much less concerned with how the house LOOKS ("Why is that toolbox in the middle of the living room floor?") and, rather, concentrate on getting things arranged so they serve my needs.

    But, then again, this often results in CHAOS (Can't Have Anyone Over, Syndrome)

  6. #16
    But, then again, this often results in CHAOS (Can't Have Anyone Over, Syndrome)
    That's funny

    How accessible would it be, for you, there? If it's going to be a PITA to use, then is it really worth the effort? Similarly, will any "assisted living" facility that you end up in have room to accommodate it? (or, would you rely on them providing whatever you needed?)
    Won't be a PITA for me I won't be the one bringing it in the house. lol Actually my place is well ramped, just a small lip coming through the patio door.

    Believe me, LOOKS is very low on my list. My house is all about functionality. A quad doesn't live independently for over 41 years worrying about looks. The problem is I can't think of a place inside the house where those long legs of a lift wouldn't be in the way. To be honest, except for emergencies, a lift wouldn't function in my house. Wouldn't work with my bed/toilet/bath/hallways/doorways. But I own my house so if I need to knock a wall out, I'll knock a wall out.

  7. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Saint Petersburg , Florida
    Posts
    906
    Quote Originally Posted by automation View Post
    The problem with all battery systems (battery powered devices) is matching the actual usage with the usage patterns for which the system was designed.

    For example, battery powered tools are designed for rapid recharge -- because a "worker" doesn't want to have to wait around for a battery to charge (so, you'd like the battery to charge in the time that your "spare" takes to "run down").

    I have lots of UPSs, here. We rarely have outages so the need for the batteries is very "occasional". And, when there is an outage, it is often brief (lights flickering, etc.). Even if it is extended, I can arrange to shut down the computer promptly. So, I can tolerate batteries having "reduced capacity".

    I'd prefer the UPSs to treat the batteries very gently -- with a goal towards maximizing their useful life. But, the UPS designers want the batteries to be recharged quickly (to protect against any OTHER outages). And, they are in the business of selling batteries so the idea of making the batteries last longer just doesn't fit with their mindsets!

    If you're designing a lift, you are probably assuming it sees daily usage. So, you want the batteries to "always" appear to be fully charged. You probably DON'T plan on a lift sitting in the corner, on its charger, WAITING to be used at some future date. As a result, you design the battery pack and charger for the "regular usage" case -- at the expense of the "maximal lifespan".

    [I hate batteries -- because they "always" need replacing when you need them! (how often do you notice the batteries in your flashlight are dead when you AREN'T USING the flashlight?! ]
    All I know is I don't understand how batteries work. I don't know when to charge my cell phone. Charge it everyday or when it dies? Everyone has an opinion on it.

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by HACKNSACK44 View Post
    All I know is I don't understand how batteries work. I don't know when to charge my cell phone. Charge it everyday or when it dies? Everyone has an opinion on it.
    Battery care is primarily dictated by the particular chemistry involved. E.g., "flashlight batteries" were carbon-zinc. NiCads are nickel-cadmium. NiMH are nickel-metal hydride. Etc. What a particular battery chemistry "likes" and dislikes is a function of its chemistry (and mechanical design).

    Most batteries do not like to be deeply discharged -- ~80% of their capacity used. (An exception is batteries expressly designed to TOLERATE deep discharge -- like "marine" batteries). The deep discharge alters the internal composition of the components in a way that adversely affects the battery's ability to take (and hold) a charge. Lead-acid batteries (like the sealed "gel" cels common in power/wheel-chairs) tend to consider ~30% to be a "normal" discharge (the sort that has a smaller affect on long-term reliability).

    Most battery chemistries don't like to "go flat". This can precipitate the (premature) end of a battery's life.

    [This suggests you'd want to recharge often. But, that means having lots of excess/unused capacity which translates into extra cost, weight, etc. And, why HAVE that excess capacity if you aren't going to USE it??!]

    Most battery chemistries are temperature sensitive. You would charge a battery differently at 70 degrees than at 85 degrees. Or, 95 degrees! Batteries "self-discharge" (go flat) at different rates depending on the temperature at which they are stored. (A car battery can lose ~4% of its charge in a day or two "just sitting") Note that this ignores the discharge effects of devices that never COMPLETELY power off (e.g., anything that doesn't have a mechanical power switch is draining SOME power even when OFF).

    Most batteries prefer "cool" to "hot". E.g., operating a (lead-acid/gel) battery at 85 degrees HALVES its expected lifespan at 70 degrees.

    Most batteries prefer to be charged at slower rates; "don't rush me!" E.g., gel cells prefer to be recharged at a ~10% rate (10% of their discharge/usage rate). This isn't often compatible with how quickly their users want to put them back into service.

    Most batteries don't like being OVER-charged. But a charger can take this into account (if it has been designed properly and can monitor the TRUE state of the battery -- THIS battery).

    You also have to consider the ease/cost of battery replacement and the possible (profit?) motives of the device manufacturer. There's obviously more incentive to preserve as much battery life as possible for a device where the battery is hard to replace (embedded pacemaker) than one where it can be easily replaced with an OTS part (flashlight).

    [I have a lot of UPSs because, IME, people/businesses just toss the things out when the batteries fail rather than dealing with the hassle -- and inflated costs -- or replacing the batteries. You're not likely to do that with a powerchair or a phone!]

    When deciding how to treat a battery, you have to think of the application and how "most folks" would EXPECT the battery to perform IN THAT APPLICATION. Phones tend to see lots of regular usage. So, you would expect the phone to need (based on usage) to be recharged more frequently than that "emergency flashlight" you purchased. You would HOPE the manufacturer had a similar usage concept in mind when choosing the battery (chemistry, capacity), the charging algorithm and the charger technology.

    E.g., I have a bunch of giant flashlights (the sort you can use to illuminate trees on the mountain across the valley). These aren't very expensive (compared to a telephone). And, see intermittent use. So, the chargers are pretty simplistic -- and can easily "cook" the battery if left plugged in too long (more than a day).

    By contrast, your phone has a computer in it and lots of smarts to figure out how to eke out every last bit of "usage" from your battery. It knows how much "energy" it has sucked out of the battery and, therefore, can predict when the battery will "go flat" - and shut itself off before that happens. It can use this information to control HOW the battery is recharged (if the battery has only had a little "energy" sucked from it, it can opt for a gentler charging cycle than if the battery is deeply depleted and the user is likely to want to be able to USE the phone, again, SOON!)

    But, this "smarts" comes with some additional costs. The little computer has to be periodically retrained to know the PRESENT characteristics of the battery. If you're always just "topping off" a barely depleted battery, it has no idea of the overall capacity of the battery, at this point in its life. So, there is an advantage to letting the battery MORE DEEPLY discharge before being recharged. This lets the computer "see" more of the battery's characteristics and better update its internal (mathematical) model of the battery -- to better predict running time and recharging needs.

    Of course, deep discharges have consequences -- see above. So, you need to strike a happy medium.

    I don't use a cell phone. I only carry one (with no cell service) when I am away from home. It serves as my wristwatch, camera, magnifying glass (take photo, zoom), music player, portable WiFi terminal, note pad, etc. In a pinch, I could use it to dial "911".

    I tend to use it in this manner for ~5 hours at a time. When I return home, I turn it OFF (not "standby) and toss it on a shelf until just before I am expecting to need it, again. Then, recharge it. In this way, it is always fully charged when I use it and yet never really discharges significantly between charges (cuz I'll probably use it again next week).

    OTOH, I keep an iPhone (again, no service) in the center console in one of the cars. Primarily as a camera/911 phone. It sits (OFF) in the car for a month or more at a time before I remember to check to see if it needs to be charged. (I keep a charging cable in the console so I can plug the phone in -- USB ports in the car -- while driving if I suspect I'll forget to bring it into the house to charge).

  9. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Saint Petersburg , Florida
    Posts
    906
    Quote Originally Posted by wes4dbt View Post
    Hack, Do you use your on a regular basis?
    We only use it when on vacation. Usually every couple of months. Last time we used it was in July. We are hoping to go on vacation Thanksgiving weekend.

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by HACKNSACK44 View Post
    We only use it when on vacation. Usually every couple of months. Last time we used it was in July. We are hoping to go on vacation Thanksgiving weekend.
    rarely use our molift but keep battery on charger always. use it for vacations and 1 or 2x per month to get in my recliner.
    Bike-on.com rep
    John@bike-on.com
    c4/5 inc funtioning c6. 28 yrs post.
    sponsored handcycle racer

Similar Threads

  1. hoyer advance patient lift
    By cripdawg in forum Equipment & Services
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 09-27-2015, 04:16 PM
  2. Hoyer Advance E lift
    By cripdawg in forum Equipment & Services
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 07-25-2015, 01:19 PM
  3. Hoyer Advance lift battery
    By LindaT in forum Equipment
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 06-09-2012, 09:08 PM
  4. Wanted: Hoyer Advance Lift
    By john878 in forum Equipment & Services
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 02-13-2012, 12:55 PM
  5. Hoyer Advance lift
    By ergvepeog in forum Equipment
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 10-01-2006, 02:07 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •