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Thread: Permobil seat elevator

  1. #11
    If you have the opportunity, get it new on your chair. If you don't want to use it, then don't, but it'll always be there for you. I'd never thought about getting it, but had it on my last chair and I use it all the time!
    "It is every man's obligation to put back into the world at least the equivalent of what he takes out of it. Try not to become a man of success but rather try to become a man of value." - Albert Einstein

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by landrover View Post
    It is something I will certainly consider for my next chair. My only concern is hearing that the seat elevator adds an additional inch of seat height. I sit tall in my chair as is. An additional inch would make my minivan head clearance even tighter.

    Well you have some time to figure pros and cons but I am working with someone now in the same issue has only a few inches to clear head room, but after all was said he really wants and needs the seat elevation.

    Who knows what will be available in 4-5 years!

    FYI I have seen some F3's on ebay, offer up and craiglist for $1000 with seat elevation!

    Automation...I would never pay MSRP for F3 seat elevation everything is negotiable.

    When I got mine I bought it from NuMotion at cost $1000 add on.

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by DeadEye View Post
    If you have the opportunity, get it new on your chair. If you don't want to use it, then don't, but it'll always be there for you. I'd never thought about getting it, but had it on my last chair and I use it all the time!
    100% agree but sad this mobility industry is not customer focused and hear all the time ATPs and DME's talking customers out of seat elevation saying its not fundable!!

    So if ones DME says that before even starting an order ask for a new ATP because most get incentives and or commission for selling chairs!

    Partner with someone that is going to work harder to fund it and argue need.

  4. #14
    Just to expound on my previous comment-yes, it is expensive. If you get it, when the chair is built-you have experienced assemblers doing the installation. It has to pass several quality inspections, before it ever leaves the manufacturer-this is true for pretty much every brand, not just Permobil.
    A new chair is expensive-given all the things I read here, and on other forums-do you really want the average dealer technician doing the install?
    Sadly, many of them don't even know what a voltmeter is.
    No way would I let most of these guys touch my chair.
    Certainly not to install something that involved-change a tire-maybe, but install a part I paid a few K$ to buy?-nope, not gonna happen.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by RollPositive View Post
    FYI I have seen some F3's on ebay, offer up and craiglist for $1000 with seat elevation!
    Lots of second hand kit available! Folks replacing chairs, folks dying, etc. Often, people just wanting someone to take "Dad's chair" off their hands after he passed away. You can sometimes see them in second-hand stores for a few hundred dollars (with batteries that have long since gone flat from lack of maintenance). Usually, the biggest issue is one of getting it transported (intact!) to your location from wherever it resides, currently (in the case of online sales).

    Automation...I would never pay MSRP for F3 seat elevation everything is negotiable.
    Of course! My point is that it's not "inexpensive" and, without Medicare/Insurance's discount and the 20% limit on "your share", it's a big piece of change (assume Medicare gets a price of ~80% MSRP and you then pay 20% of that suggests buying it in the initial chair order would run you ~$700, installed and warrantied.

    When I got mine I bought it from NuMotion at cost $1000 add on.
    Was that an add on at time of original chair purchase? Or, a retrofit to an existing chair (including labor to remove fixed seat and replace with elevator -- I suspect a significant difference!)?

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by rlnguy View Post
    Just to expound on my previous comment-yes, it is expensive. If you get it, when the chair is built-you have experienced assemblers doing the installation. It has to pass several quality inspections, before it ever leaves the manufacturer-this is true for pretty much every brand, not just Permobil.
    A new chair is expensive-given all the things I read here, and on other forums-do you really want the average dealer technician doing the install?
    Sadly, many of them don't even know what a voltmeter is.
    No way would I let most of these guys touch my chair.
    Certainly not to install something that involved-change a tire-maybe, but install a part I paid a few K$ to buy?-nope, not gonna happen.
    Permobil said they will not sell seat elevation as a stand alone hardware...

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by automation View Post
    Lots of second hand kit available! Folks replacing chairs, folks dying, etc. Often, people just wanting someone to take "Dad's chair" off their hands after he passed away. You can sometimes see them in second-hand stores for a few hundred dollars (with batteries that have long since gone flat from lack of maintenance). Usually, the biggest issue is one of getting it transported (intact!) to your location from wherever it resides, currently (in the case of online sales).



    Of course! My point is that it's not "inexpensive" and, without Medicare/Insurance's discount and the 20% limit on "your share", it's a big piece of change (assume Medicare gets a price of ~80% MSRP and you then pay 20% of that suggests buying it in the initial chair order would run you ~$700, installed and warrantied.



    Was that an add on at time of original chair purchase? Or, a retrofit to an existing chair (including labor to remove fixed seat and replace with elevator -- I suspect a significant difference!)?

    Its not hard to ship used equipment, if you can get a good deal at $1000 and $300-500 to ship you still win.

    I would look at motorcycle haulers, movers etc and explain you need help and most will step up.

    Have a friend that used the company to inspect the chair before he paid!

    Having just bought a chair for a friend I have seen something knew and not sure if its legit or people selling not really knowing.

    Pride is very misleading in there marketing that I pointed out to Pride when ilevel 1st came out.

    It has a sticker on all Edge chairs claiming iLevel compatible which makes people think its included.

    Make sure you get a serial number before buying and your local DME can tell you features included.

    Even get a picture of the seat elevated.

    We found a new Pride Edge with tilt and recline and power leg rest and seat elevation for $4000, we offered $1000 and they took it.

    Went out to test the chair and no iLevel but they pointed out the sticker and the manuel shows how to use it.

    I showed them on the joystick the seat bottom is grayed out and with iLevel it would light up as the seat goes up and down.

    My DME confirmed features with serial number and it had no seat elevation.

    So we reoffered $900 for the mistake and they took it.

    Not a fan of Pride Edge but it was a new chair with 25 miles on it, user passed and the chair was clean and friend needed something fast.

    New batteries and he is good to go, reliable mobility for less then $1400

    One of the biggest things is to remember chair width is important. If you are someone that needs a 16" wide and you might be looking at a 20" wide chair.

    Not all chairs are adjustable.

    When you start the funding process your ATP can put in all features, not all may get approved and you can remove them or self pay. There is no added cost for labor to add features.

    Chairs are built per order at the factory by manufactures and sent semi built to the DME.

    DMEs are adding things like headrest, cub holders minimal things.

    So feature like seat elevation, lights, USB charging, utility hooks are things you can work with your DME on selling at cost.

    I have helped people on medicare and everything was covered including elevation so there was no 20%

    If something didnt get approved I would appeal and if still not approved this is where you can ask the DME to sell it at cost.

    They still make money and dont want to lose the sale.
    Last edited by RollPositive; 05-25-2018 at 03:18 PM.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by RollPositive View Post
    Its not hard to ship used equipment, if you can get a good deal at $1000 and $300-500 to ship you still win.
    Yes -- its just more effort on the part of the buyer and seller. And, you often have to be aware of the chair's availability soon after it becomes available.

    As I said, upthread, often the seller is not the principal but, rather, someone charged with "getting rid of the chair" after a death or, for a user who is otherwise unable to deal with the chair's disposal (many users may be old, infirm, senile, in nursing homes, etc.). The "daughter-in-law" may be eager to just get the chair out of her house where its being stored until "sale"/disposal.

    Having just bought a chair for a friend I have seen something knew and not sure if its legit or people selling not really knowing.
    It has a sticker on all Edge chairs claiming iLevel compatible which makes people think its included.
    Despite my above-average level of cynicism, I tend to attribute most of these behaviors to ignorance and not malice or deliberate manipulation. This sort of labeling would address the main issue of this thread: "can I install that after the sale?" As such, it has some merit. (charging extra for the WHEELS would start to smell of sleaze! )

    We found a new Pride Edge with tilt and recline and power leg rest and seat elevation for $4000, we offered $1000 and they took it.
    Went out to test the chair and no iLevel but they pointed out the sticker and the manuel shows how to use it.
    No doubt the person showing the chair wasn't the principal/user! Hence my "ignorance" comment, above.

    I showed them on the joystick the seat bottom is grayed out and with iLevel it would light up as the seat goes up and down.
    Again, had they more knowledge of the product, they would have been able to more accurately describe it, initially.

    So we reoffered $900 for the mistake and they took it.
    Not a fan of Pride Edge but it was a new chair with 25 miles on it, user passed and the chair was clean and friend needed something fast.
    New batteries and he is good to go, reliable mobility for less then $1400
    There's a Q6 Edge sitting in a second hand store a week or two back with tilt/legs/elevate (or, maybe tilt/recline/elevate?), bluetooth and attendant control for $250. Again, I'm sure they look at it as a "nuisance product" as it takes up a fair bit of space on the sales floor that they could better use to selling clothing or small appliances or...

    One of the biggest things is to remember chair width is important.
    And *tires*! I found a Boss 6NS for a colleague who's not anywhere near as "wide" as the chair would suggest. But, his primary use was out-of-doors on crushed gravel. The over-wide tires (associated with the 600 lb weight capacity of the chair) made it much easier for him to navigate in the gravel.

    Chairs are built per order at the factory by manufactures and sent semi built to the DME.
    Hence the question of whether your $1000 price was the difference in "from the factory" pricing (for the elevator) or "added to an existing chair (after the sale)". Fairly common to see DME modified "after the sale" -- but, often not by the original provider (they can't/won't perform the modifications requested).

    http://newmobility.com/2016/04/under...ng-dme-prices/

  9. #19
    According to the F3 parts list, Permobil will not sell part # 1831116 SEAT ELEVATOR AP ELEVATOR. It's also not listed on the MSRP parts list.

    My contact at Permobil says that you should be able to add it. You may want to ask your dealer if they can order the part but I don't know if I would trust them to install it though. I guess if they (the dealer) break it they are obligated to make it right.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylarjoehill.h View Post
    According to the F3 parts list, Permobil will not sell part # 1831116 SEAT ELEVATOR AP ELEVATOR. It's also not listed on the MSRP parts list.


    The documents that I've found disagree (and I don't know enough to declare them "authoritative"). Attached are scans of exploded parts diagram for the F3's elevator, the "key" mapping the callouts in that diagram to Permobil P/N's (note "Sell" does not indicate "NO"!), and a pricelist that gives a price to that assembly (as of "11/03/2017"). Apologies for screwing up the color -- I had to massage the files to get them to a size that the site would tolerate. I'd post the original URLs but it appears an post with a URL ends up in a black hole...

    [Hopefully, I won't botch the order of the images when I attach them -- nope! ]

    Regardless of what the paperwork claims, the trick is finding access to an elevator mechanism (even if "surplus") and willing to rework the existing chair to fit it.



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