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Thread: TiLite titanium tubing diameter

  1. #11
    I've weighed the frames with casters, upholstery, brakes, adjustable back, and axles on my wheelchairs. Quickie TI was lighter. I don't recall the exact values. But I can repeat. They had the same upholstery, casters and brakes but different axles and back hardware. Perhaps the frames are the same weight but the axles and back hardware differ. If that is the case, then you may be right on a technicality but what difference does it make in reality? Because the axles and back hardware can't be interchanged. You have only one choice. The exception would be if you swapped out the folding back for a fixed back, which I can't do for the sake of transportation. Bottom line, My shoulder can tell the difference when putting the wheelchairs into the car. The Quickie was much kinder on my shoulder than the TR in a like comparison. Why else other than real life issues like transferring into a car do we care about weight on an every day chair?

  2. #12
    Senior Member Oddity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by August West View Post
    I've weighed the frames with casters, upholstery, brakes, adjustable back, and axles on my wheelchairs. Quickie TI was lighter. I don't recall the exact values. But I can repeat. They had the same upholstery, casters and brakes but different axles and back hardware. Perhaps the frames are the same weight but the axles and back hardware differ. If that is the case, then you may be right on a technicality but what difference does it make in reality? Because the axles and back hardware can't be interchanged. You have only one choice. The exception would be if you swapped out the folding back for a fixed back, which I can't do for the sake of transportation. Bottom line, My shoulder can tell the difference when putting the wheelchairs into the car. The Quickie was much kinder on my shoulder than the TR in a like comparison. Why else other than real life issues like transferring into a car do we care about weight on an every day chair?

    Yeah, other than lifting the chair, I don't think a couple pounds one way or another makes any difference to the pushing experience. Considering the weight of the occupant, a couple pounds is an imperceptibly small % of the total rolling package. Pushing agility/efficiency is all about geometry and rolling resistance IMO. I really liked the Ti, a lot, but lost too much confidence in it when it broke. Didn't even want a replacement. Got a Lasher instead. Been pushing that chair for 10 years this year. Still as solid as a rock. 1.375" tubing, no flex, fully featured, and light af!
    "If you only know your side of an issue, you know nothing." -John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

    "Even what those with the greatest reputation for knowing it all claim to understand and defend are but opinions..." -Heraclitus, Fragments

  3. #13
    Senior Member Andy's Avatar
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    I have a TR frame in the closet...it is like 2lbs (or ridiculously light).

    Re the Quickie...I'm sure it is light, but I had a look at one and it scared the crap out of me. I'm a 200+ lb'er though, smaller folks or those with less mechanical fatigue experiences may be confident in its structural integrity.

  4. #14
    Probably true that a 1" mono tube is asking for trouble for someone putting a lot of demand on it.

  5. #15
    Senior Member Oddity's Avatar
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    Wish they hadn't given up on it. There were some frame failures (mine was the axle plate) but they could have addressed any issues IMO. Tubing strength is heavily influenced by wall thickness, too. OD is just one aspect. I wouldn't be surprised if it were a simple business decision to get out of the titanium game. It's a bitch to work with, reimbursement had become flaky, and properly engineered aluminum tube (like the oval tube on the Q7 and it's varying wall thicknesses, etc) can be just as light, or lighter, and with proper heat treating strong enough not to make a difference to a wheelchair user.
    "If you only know your side of an issue, you know nothing." -John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

    "Even what those with the greatest reputation for knowing it all claim to understand and defend are but opinions..." -Heraclitus, Fragments

  6. #16
    Senior Member Andy's Avatar
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    Speaking of titanium, I saw a Ford Fiesta Titanium on the road today. I know Silver is a little too pedestrian for a car glorification, Gold has a negative ghetto connotation, Platinum is a trendy designation lately...but Titanium? Does that mean you are a cripple driving a clown car if you own a Fiesta Titanium? lol Anyway, I was thinking of putting a Iron Oxide emblem on the back of my winter-duty Ford to keep up with car naming trends.

    Ok...back to wheelchairs

  7. #17
    My nearly 20 year old Top End Terminator Titanium that I currently use as my indoor chair is lighter than my 2 yr. old Tilite ZRA "super lite" edition by at least 2 maybe 3lbs. What I immediately noticed was that the weight is distributed more evenly on the ZRA probably because of the front caster adjustment. The Terminator's weight is heavily biased towards the rear of the chair because I had the adjustable rear camber option and the lighter fixed front caster housings. In case your not familiar with their rear adjustable camber design, they used a hollow rear camber tube with removable inserts at each end that contained the axle sleeve(s). The heavy dual camber inserts had an axle sleeve at opposite ends in which each sleeve was set at a different angle, while the half as heavy single camber inserts contained one axle sleeve in one half and the other half was hollow. The Terminator remains a good light chair that hasn't failed me yet and my ever increasing weight over the years is now at about 190lbs.

  8. #18
    Senior Member Oddity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fasdude View Post
    My nearly 20 year old Top End Terminator Titanium that I currently use as my indoor chair is lighter than my 2 yr. old Tilite ZRA "super lite" edition by at least 2 maybe 3lbs. What I immediately noticed was that the weight is distributed more evenly on the ZRA probably because of the front caster adjustment. The Terminator's weight is heavily biased towards the rear of the chair because I had the adjustable rear camber option and the lighter fixed front caster housings. In case your not familiar with their rear adjustable camber design, they used a hollow rear camber tube with removable inserts at each end that contained the axle sleeve(s). The heavy dual camber inserts had an axle sleeve at opposite ends in which each sleeve was set at a different angle, while the half as heavy single camber inserts contained one axle sleeve in one half and the other half was hollow. The Terminator remains a good light chair that hasn't failed me yet and my ever increasing weight over the years is now at about 190lbs.

    Top End also used to allow a selection of 2 different tubing sizes on their Terminators, which is/was cool. Not sure if they still do.
    "If you only know your side of an issue, you know nothing." -John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

    "Even what those with the greatest reputation for knowing it all claim to understand and defend are but opinions..." -Heraclitus, Fragments

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