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Thread: The right to die--ethical dilemmas in persons with spinal cord injury. SCI Nurse?

  1. #71
    Also 95% of all failed suicide attemptees questioned after the failed attempt say the moment they made that plunge and attempted to take their own life immediately regretted their decision (i.e someone jumps off a bridge and the moment they jump they wish they hadn't) and wouldnt try it again. Scarey to think how many people have this thought and then bam they were act successful

  2. #72
    I'm without a shred of a doubt that almost everyone ( more likely everyone) in that survey were relatively healthy able bodied people with either substance abuse,Lost loved one, Lost job, money problems, anxiety issues, self-esteem problems etc. And quite often acted in a moment of complete desperation! Basically nothing in comparison to someone that is terminally ill and is going to die anyways, just slowly and very ugly. Or someone that is severely disabled and is always going to be severely disabled living with The limitations ( in most cases near if not completely dependent) and everything else that's associated with being severely disabled every second of everyday ( no smoke breaks lol) no matter what they do until they die. Meaning they will have to carefully plan and prepare for assisted suicide not act in the darkest most desperate moment, in fact they have to act in a clear rational state of mind ! You know The kind of people that NEED actual assistance with suicide, right? Not exactly things that can just be "helped", forgotten about or "gotten over".
    Last edited by JamesMcM; 02-22-2016 at 07:12 PM.

  3. #73
    I've been a high level, C2/3, vent dependent quad since age 3, 31 years ago. Those who have been around these forums long enough know I was working on discontinuing my vent (now diaphragm pacemaker) and being done with life. Ultimately, I found out a few things, got advanced directives with a DNR order, and moved on with life. Two years ago I was very close on getting an order to stop my pacemaker, but didn't due to doctors being unsure about it and willing to give it more time.

    No, I haven't read everything in this thread completely, but pretty close. For high injury levels like me, I would like to see an option to end life at one's choosing be more available. Doctors should be able to easily discuss it with the person and any concerns. Some safeguards would need to be in place and not have requests just due to a bad week or something. If it is their choice, then it should be attainable.

    Ultimately, I believe it's best to let your time come. Letting it come at your time though is sometimes best for the person.
    C2/3 quad since February 20, 1985.

  4. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by trainman View Post
    I've been a high level, C2/3, vent dependent quad since age 3, 31 years ago. Those who have been around these forums long enough know I was working on discontinuing my vent (now diaphragm pacemaker) and being done with life. Ultimately, I found out a few things, got advanced directives with a DNR order, and moved on with life. Two years ago I was very close on getting an order to stop my pacemaker, but didn't due to doctors being unsure about it and willing to give it more time.

    No, I haven't read everything in this thread completely, but pretty close. For high injury levels like me, I would like to see an option to end life at one's choosing be more available. Doctors should be able to easily discuss it with the person and any concerns. Some safeguards would need to be in place and not have requests just due to a bad week or something. If it is their choice, then it should be attainable.

    Ultimately, I believe it's best to let your time come. Letting it come at your time though is sometimes best for the person.

    Wow I can't believe that! Sorry that you've lost so much control of yourself you have doctors pulling the strings like that! From what I've read it seems like they seem to be leaning towards letting you go, then all the sudden have a change of heart that's fucked up. Now I'm at the bottom end of being a high injury (C5 complete, potential damage to the C4 because I didn't come out with "normal" C5 arm function but every injury is different we don't understand the spinal cord Fully) , andwhen I talk or see people with higher injuries than mine I don't take that for granite as much as I can. I touch my face a lot because I can still feel it, I can't feel my hands or arms or anything else but I can feel my face, so I often have my hand resting on my face it just helps, to have a sensory inspired reinsurance that something of me is still there.. And I really have to value that minuscule fact! Because I know what it is to have to rely on somebody else for almost everything, it's belittling, it's disheartening, makes you question your existence, it's undignified and then when you live like that long enough you have no choice but to accept and expect help, it's frustrating! Because sometimes you just want to get something done and guess what, like always you're going to have to wait for help! So I really got to respect the fact that at least I can get that reassurance the second I want to...

    On the other side, I'm very analytical, I think things through try to look at both sides of everything Fact is on the functional standpoint what's left of my arms provides very little.I can feed myself, I can brush my own teeth , I can drink my water ( small things like that ) but I'd be delusional to believe I can actually do these on my own they have to be given to me at least, often set up or with a "special" tool. I can also be placed and then hold myself in what's called a seating position but without at least some core stability and two pronating and supination forearmsit has no functional purpose just exercise! None of these things really have any improvement on quality of life. But I can breathe my own air I don't have to carry that thing around On my chair, came close (yes you heard that correctly C-5 almost got a ventilator, lungs collapsed, had the trach just, hospital I went to way over their head) so there's no comparison! What am I getting at, I'm not one of those na?ve fool's trying to say how bad paraplegia is to a quadriplegic, even though you and I are much closer as I just explain there's still no comparison i'd still have to be extremely ignorant and na?ve to think so as I just explain. But what did I just talk about? Well I just had a comparison of twopeople, a comparison of minuscule portions I'am talking about scratching our own head, touching our own fucking face as if it's a treasured cherished gift. The severity of these kind of injuries cannot be understood, when you get in water this deep there are no safeguards my friend... those kind of measures are for paraplegic low quadriplegics, very incomplete minor injuries, and disabilities the people that can very easily do it themselves a number of different ways they see fit, but are still requesting assistance... injuries that are bad enough have to think long and hard about it, it's not just some little fit, The sad thing is it's bad enough they'll be in clear mind when time come, nothing to soften it, harsh world.
    Last edited by JamesMcM; 03-02-2016 at 12:37 AM.

  5. #75
    The last two Vice episodes were very interesting. One was a woman in Holland that ended her life legally because of ptsd. Another story was a 42 year old blind woman that was born blind but had surgery to be able to see at 40 years old. She wanted to die.

    It it seems to me that humans place too much value on life as opposed to the quality of that life.

  6. #76
    Senior Member lynnifer's Avatar
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    T-11 Flaccid Paraplegic due to TM July 1985 @ age 12

  7. #77
    FWIW I had 3 near misses, and am thankful I survived.

    I am ambulatory but with complications in my hands and below my waist. About 8 major spinal surgeries, multiple revisions. I have fully elaborated Central Pain, the kind of pain you vomit, lose bladder, cannot process sound or vision and scream til your throat bleeds.

    I manage better now. My experience has changed through Insight Mindfulness Meditation. After 10 years of living in a death spiral I am 2 years whole and engaged with life. My injuries will never heal, the baseline pain is better, the bad episodes remain where they have been.

    Happy to be here.

    I teach meditation now www.pathwaytomindfulness.com We work with a variety of clients with multiple physical and mental issues.

    Not here much but my chronicle of suicidal depression can be searched.

    Pax -ket

  8. #78
    I remember when you (Ket) were ready to give up. You are a great example that it is possible for things to improve. At the same time, I realize it is not possible for everyone.

    It is great to see you doing so well and helping others.

  9. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    I remember when you (Ket) were ready to give up. You are a great example that it is possible for things to improve. At the same time, I realize it is not possible for everyone.

    It is great to see you doing so well and helping others.
    Well said, Every injury is different with more or less limitations and more or less secondary complications! And everyone injured is a different individual with different interests, passions, values and principles etc. But Imo it's not about it not being possible, anything can improve the impact of that "improvements" is of course subjective. but rather a choice that to much is gone to live a dignified and meaningful life, no matter what the improvements. let alone enough remaining to justify being a burden/ dependent. Then of course there are certain situations rational realizations come in and some people don't want to end up in a group home, or end up collecting disability etc.

  10. #80
    I will never stand in judgment and realize where I am is not possible for everyone, just made a personal observation.

    I would also note that we can work on our mind, one may reach the same decision, to self terminate, but should
    I do so now I can say I did it fully aware.

    Love us all

    I will talk with anyone interested PM me

    Warmly -ket

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