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Thread: Off-road Project

  1. #11
    Well, at this moment I do not have a place to work, so most everything is at a standstill on this project. I am going over my plans tho, and making a few changes and/or improvements. The 3-wheeler has a front fender, that will be retained. The drive wheels do not have fenders, so they will be added. Seeing as the plan is to use this in areas that are often wet and muddy, I consider having fenders is to be pretty much essential. Also, considering the areas this is intended for, I will probably have the tires filled with foam, so they won't go flat, even if they get a large puncture - insulating foam is useless for this, some tire places have the foam needed. I plan on pulling a small trailer also, probably with car tires, smaller tires would be harder to pull over the ruts. I have a second parts 3-wheeler, and plan on using it for another build. The second one will be for my older son, who will do the junkyard work. LOL The next step is finding some square tubing, and start measuring and cutting. I may have to take everything to my son's to do the welding and assembling, if I can't work on it at home - not my first choice. I'd post a picture or two, but my phone has decided it will no longer send photos to my computer. Also, the software for posting photos from my camera to my computer is on my old computer, that fried a board. I will be pulling the hard drive and see if I can transfer the software.

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim View Post
    Maybe use this for some ideas.

    http://www.gennymobility.com/
    Hey! This is nice!
    Gary Is = L-1 Para for 34 years.....................
    ~~~~~~~~~~

  3. #13
    Still doing some research on this. As I plan on a gas engine for propulsion, I wanted it to be as quiet as I could make it. Apparently the answer is a scooter muffler. Seems car mufflers won't do much, because of sound cycles, or some such, didn't delve too deeply into that. But scooter mufflers seem to do the trick. I can well believe that, because a few days ago a guy on a scooter pulled up beside me while I was parked, and I didn't even know he was there untill he got off it. That is quiet, and I know that those things are irritatingly loud with no muffler, so I was quite impressed. I later found out that used mufflers are easily found on craigslist, at quite reasonable prices. I'm thinking of using two, just for the look. Still no work space yet.

  4. #14
    Can this be sold under $800?
    walking is OVER-RATED!!!

    Broken in August 14th, 2003. T9-L1 complete.

  5. #15
    Senior Member
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    I'm here in NC in Hampstead, I am working on an off road electric really an all purpose Powered Chair. I do prefer a rear wheeled chair with pneumatic tires for comfort. If you use tubeless tires (4 ply) and tubeless wheels, you have to work real hard to puncture them. Then you can have the advantage of the traction of the soft low pressure tire, as well as the softer ride. Just saying! Foam filled of course are pretty much flat proof of course, but do have disadvantages. There are flat preventing products made that will allow you to use pneumatic tubeless tires that are more than 99% effective for the uses we want to put them to.

    It does seem you have set your mind on a scooter type vehicle, and that is OK, I just have little information to provide you for this kind of vehicle. I do know that all you require is a very small scooter type engine for your propulsion. And some sort of direct drive or trans-axle. The power requirements for a <10 Mph scooter are minimal.

    I want to make a beach/woods powered Wheelchair that I can still navigate in restaurants, stores, and in my home. A low center of gravity is one of the keys to such a chair. The Overall Width will still be close to 24" and length as minimal as possible (for turning in restricted spaces) with the seating as far back as possible to get as much weight off the front tires as possible, without making it "TOO" tippy. This is a problem with all wheeled vehicles. The front caster tires will also be a wider variety for better flotation on soft going. The current intention is to use a LiFePO4 battery system, much the same as is used by the Burgerman on WheelChairDriver. He has perfected a power system using this kind of battery that actually works, but hardly inexpensive, by your standards. But far less expensive than ANY factory made all purpose Powered WheelChair, both in the short run as well as the long run. He built his to operate on 48 VDC increasing his speed to 15 Mph. I need only a 6-8 Mph chair so the standard 24 volt controller is quite sufficient.

    By the way, if you use his system of battery power in a 3 or 4 wheel scooter, you can make a 10+ year life span battery. This will give you at least double the range that can be expected from a Lead Acid battery, with half the overall weight, and much more amp hour availability. Take a look at Battery University Site on your browser as well as WheelChairDriver pages. Good luck with your endeavors, and adventures.

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by nia adha View Post
    Can this be sold under $800?
    Well, in honesty, I would have to say it depends. It could, yes, however, most people are going to want to get the cost of materials back, and to be paid for their labor. Cost of materials will differ, depending on a lot of variables, used or new, etc. And some people think there labor is worth more than other people do.

    So, my design 'could' sell for under $800. I doubt seriously 'I' would make one for sale, at any price, simply because I am just interested in making one for me, and one for my son. I have two, free, three-wheel ATVs donors, a new gas engine will run right around $100, and probably from around $25 to $100 for pieces that have to bought, i.e., tubing, welding wire, seat, etc. I will say that if I decided to sell one, or both of these at a later date, they will not be priced anywhere $800. The first one will take longer, so labor time would be more than the the second one. In truth, I really do not know if I will be wanting to make more than the two or not. I do know that if I were to make one for someone else, I would charge a lot less if they came up with the donor vehicle than if I had to round one up.

    At this point in time, all of this is in my head, I do not know if I will ever make plans (more like 'how I did it') or not. If I do it is a pretty simple design. I have been thinking of sketching some up tho, and if it gets to that point it would be pretty simple to do one. At that point, if I really wanted one, I would find a small welding shop and talk to them about making one for you. They would probably be much more enthusiastic about doing it if you searched out the major parts. I would think they would charge a very reasonable price for something like this. If you let them know you would be good with them doing work on it between other jobs, rather than one shot, they would be more flexible on price. I'd take some pictures of what my donor materials are, except my phone stopped sending photos to my computer, and my camera software is on the computer that died, so can't get pictures from it either. Bah.

  7. #17
    I really should get back here oftener than I do. Still no place to work. If I do decide to go with foam filled tires, it will be on down the line. I don't plan to use one of these off-road as such, but in auto salvage yards, where there are always sharp pieces lying around, so chances of a puncture are higher than in most places; I will go with no foam for awhile and see how that goes. Ride comfort either way should be no major issue, because the ground in them is all dirt, and pretty level and relatively smooth; speed will be reasonably slow also.

    I'm going with a three-wheeler, single wheel in the rear, partly because it should prove simpler to build, and also because I have two three-wheel ATVs for parts. I'm going for gas power, mostly because the plan is to use this only outside, it will be simple enough to put together, and I have never understood electrical stuff since I was in high school - and I graduated in 1958, you do the math. Chain drive to the axle on the two front wheels. I will not be going with a scooter type engine, I'll either opt for a new 4-cycle engine from a place like Harbor Freight, or a Briggs & Stratton. There will be no electric drive for this concept.

    I have been doing some thinking on later converting the engine to run on propane. I know they run propane powered forklifts indoors, so am wondering if a propane version would be allowed indoors, for things like craft shows, boat shows, and the like. With a ultra-quiet scooter muffler, they may not even notice the difference.

  8. #18
    Senior Member RSieck's Avatar
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    Eastern Iowa
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Sullivan View Post
    I'm here in NC in Hampstead, I am working on an off road electric really an all purpose Powered Chair. I do prefer a rear wheeled chair with pneumatic tires for comfort. If you use tubeless tires (4 ply) and tubeless wheels, you have to work real hard to puncture them. Then you can have the advantage of the traction of the soft low pressure tire, as well as the softer ride. Just saying! Foam filled of course are pretty much flat proof of course, but do have disadvantages. There are flat preventing products made that will allow you to use pneumatic tubeless tires that are more than 99% effective for the uses we want to put them to.

    It does seem you have set your mind on a scooter type vehicle, and that is OK, I just have little information to provide you for this kind of vehicle. I do know that all you require is a very small scooter type engine for your propulsion. And some sort of direct drive or trans-axle. The power requirements for a <10 Mph scooter are minimal.

    I want to make a beach/woods powered Wheelchair that I can still navigate in restaurants, stores, and in my home. A low center of gravity is one of the keys to such a chair. The Overall Width will still be close to 24" and length as minimal as possible (for turning in restricted spaces) with the seating as far back as possible to get as much weight off the front tires as possible, without making it "TOO" tippy. This is a problem with all wheeled vehicles. The front caster tires will also be a wider variety for better flotation on soft going. The current intention is to use a LiFePO4 battery system, much the same as is used by the Burgerman on WheelChairDriver. He has perfected a power system using this kind of battery that actually works, but hardly inexpensive, by your standards. But far less expensive than ANY factory made all purpose Powered WheelChair, both in the short run as well as the long run. He built his to operate on 48 VDC increasing his speed to 15 Mph. I need only a 6-8 Mph chair so the standard 24 volt controller is quite sufficient.

    By the way, if you use his system of battery power in a 3 or 4 wheel scooter, you can make a 10+ year life span battery. This will give you at least double the range that can be expected from a Lead Acid battery, with half the overall weight, and much more amp hour availability. Take a look at Battery University Site on your browser as well as WheelChairDriver pages. Good luck with your endeavors, and adventures.
    I plan on starting to do the exact same thing this spring as you are planning on doing. Same battery setup (if possible) even.

    My biggest hold up is I don't know where to find the battery..lol

    Plan on building my own frame, robbing controls and some gear driven motors off a donor chair. 29" wide at max with hopefully 8" wide tires on rear and whatever I can fit up front. Rear wheel drive, and hopefully around 6" minimum ground clearance.

    It is to be an all purpose chair, something I can hunt out of, goto farm auctions, yet still take into a store if needed and not full of mud or manure from cattle chores...lol
    T8/9 (2-24-06)
    IOWA

  9. #19
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    Try this for a web site http://www.headway-headquarters.com/ This is the USA Distributor for these batteries. You can try eBay as well. Charging this set up is tricky the first time if you make it from individual cells. "i" would not use a Battery Maintenance System (BMS) Lots of information From John Williamson, and a few others on the this site; http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/board/viewforum.php Some of the info is daunting if you are not an electronics freak. But if you stick it out and succeed the results will be more than simply worthwhile. There is just so much more energy available from a LiFePO4 than a Lead/Acid (Pb) battery.

    Do NOT confuse a LiFePO4 battery with a Lipo battery. Lipo's are reputed to burn up under many conditions. None of us need a battery burning up under our BUTT, that becomes more than uncomfortable quickly. And charging a Lipo beside your bed could easily kill and burn your house down. However, LiFePO4 battery's used as a power supplier for a powered Wheelchair will not burn under almost any condition, and it does not exude hydrogen gasses when it is being charged as a Pb battery may do, especially when it is in the last phases of its life span. LiFePO4 batteries have, (if you use it and maintain it properly) an expected life span of 5000 recharges until its ability to maintain at least an 80% storage capacity! 10 years or so, so that is at least to me pretty impressive. And they like to be stored at less than 100% charge. They do not self discharge if you disconnect them from your chair. The chair "may" be the source of small power drain, even if they are turned off.

    There are a lot of do's and don'ts but most are things both LiFePO4 and Pb batteries have in common. But the day to day use will extend your range as well as your full charge time. If you read the WheelChairDriver site especially the Main site not just the forum board you will be inundated with John's "how to" opinions and instructions. They are worth your time to read and make up your own mind what you want to make for an Off Road Powered Wheelchair. AND maybe just how to do it.

    The Headway site was being constructed when I last visited it. I just flashed it to copy its address and there "looks" to be more stuff on there now.

  10. #20
    Senior Member
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    Sep 2001
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    middle georgia
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    I have a dumb question why are there not gas power I am moving to beach looking at track chairs but I am scared to death of running out of power plus be limited to several miles

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