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Thread: Disabled parking placards / wheelchair specific placards?

  1. #11
    Senior Member NW-Will's Avatar
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    After talking to dozens of Portland City people, finally found out
    Portland Or has a form for out of state wheelchair users that your doctor must sign.

    When used in conjunction with your state placard, you can have the same benefits as an Oregon Wheelchair user.
    Of course there are no direct links to the form !!! (and I still can't attach and documents on CareCure!)

    I guess now I have to work on the state legislature to get a two tier disabled placard system in this state, so we can get reciprocity when we travel.

  2. #12
    Senior Member ~Lin's Avatar
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    I would prefer parking permit enforcement and education. I do think the van spaces should not be taken first if you don't genuinely need the space, but I don't believe if someone with a parking permit for say a heart condition arrived and the only available space was a van one that they should not be able to park there.

    There are so many different types of disabilities, and I don't feel its right to "tier" them in any sort of priority parking. I think if people were educated better they hopefully wouldn't do stupid stuff like parking in the crosshatch spaces (ILLEGAL!), or take spots next to crosshatching if they don't need it and other spaces are available. Wheelchair users aren't the only people who need additional space to exit and enter their vehicles, and so need the crosshatching. And if you're going to start saying one disability has priority over another that would be a huge mess. Are you going to have multiple disability specific spaces for wheelchair users who also have heart or lung conditions? What about those with SCI and other disabilities that don't use wheelchairs but require extensive orthotics, prosthetics, crutches, walkers, etc and the room to get them out of the vehicle?

    Personally I think the problem in disabled parking is people only thinking of themselves, and so there will be no solution in people only worrying about themselves. We have disabled people who either don't know or don't care and so park in the crosshatching blocking the individuals who parked in that spot FOR the crosshatching. We have disabled people who park in the spaces when they do not actually need them or they are not actually the best space for them just because they can (I once watched a woman get out of her car in the disabled spot, then walk down the sidewalk to enter a door in front of 4 open parking spaces.) Drivers just sitting in the disabled spaces for long periods waiting on people. And of course the biggest problem would be vehicles without placards or with stolen placards.

    I've had 2 placards stolen myself. One through my cracked window while I was in the ER, another when my car was broken into. When I went to have them replaced I brought with me the number that was on the cards thinking they would have some sort of way to report that card as lost/stolen.... But no. My only relief was that they eventually expired. Well, now Indiana went to "no expire" permits for those with permanent disabilities. Which means if stolen they're good forever unless the individual gets caught which seems pretty unlikely since we can't even get the police to care about people parked in the spaces without ANY placard! I'd like to see random checking of placards to verify the owner is the one using it, and hefty fines with confiscation if it isn't. It happens now and then, I've seen news articles on youtube where they've done it at certain events. And there are so many violators it brings in TONS of money. So in my mind there really is no reason other than the lack of people caring about others that prevents something being done. Everyone wants to pass the buck. Stores say its up to police, police say its up to stores. I'm sure the amount of money brought in by violators would pay to cover employment to do randomized checking. Especially setting up checking of all placards at big events. And when an officer is on duty, how about they have to randomly check x number of placards (and have a way to see if its a stolen one) when they aren't busy.

    Instead of dividing up disabilities, I'd like to see us all come together for real change.
    Board Member of Assistance Dog Advocacy Project working in Education. Feel free to ask me any service dog questions!

    I am not paralyzed. I have a genetic connective tissue disorder with neuro complications and a movement disorder.

  3. #13
    Super Moderator Sue Pendleton's Avatar
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    I know part of the problem are states or municipalities that cannot give tickets out on private property. I lived in a city like that in Maryland. If you parked in a fire lane the security cops at the mall would call the county fire marshall's office to right a summons citation. And the fire guys came by on a regular basis around Christmas. But county police could not write parking tickets without the permission of the owner of the mall. Hey, I lived in a corporation not a city or town according to the state's laws. So the HP slots are there as a service to customers along with the current fine but it is not, or wasn't when we left in 2012, enforced.

    For everyone else, I tend to agree. My Dad had a HP placard for the last 10 years or so of his life and mainly used it in hot weather until the last few years when he had problems walking very far. Me? I can roll a long way using my power chair. And thanks for the reminder. I need to turn his placard in before we sell his car.
    Courage doesn't always roar. Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying, "I will try again tomorrow."

    Disclaimer: Answers, suggestions, and/or comments do not constitute medical advice expressed or implied and are based solely on my experiences as a SCI patient. Please consult your attending physician for medical advise and treatment. In the event of a medical emergency please call 911.

  4. #14
    Senior Member NW-Will's Avatar
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    Not wanting to take this more off topic.... trying to figure what is the law pertaining to placards in your area
    If I visit your city can I park with my placard ?

    The original intent of the Handicapped placard for parking was just for wheelchair users, it has been diluted over time, and ironically it seems we're going back to where it started.
    Wasn't to get you close to anything it was to put parking in a safe location so you weren't hit by other vehicles as it was considered we were less visible to other motorists as we wheeled around.

    It seems like some where in the legislature the vehicle parking concessions really only apply to wheelchair users hence states are breaking disabled placards and wheelchair users into two groups.
    If you have a disable placard municipalities will offer parking spots, but you'll have to pay and there will be time constraints when metering is concerned.
    If you're a wheel chair user there are no time restraints.

    As for corporate parking lots, I know in Washington state if they put up the state disabled sign and no placard is displayed the local police will respond if called. The same if someone parks on the hashmarks, last time I called someone in it cost them $450. Large supermarket parking lot.

    I've noticed Corporate lots putting up disabled parking spaces which are now being signed "WheelChair user only" . Now I know they are differentiating the Placard it makes sense.

  5. #15
    Super Moderator Sue Pendleton's Avatar
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    NW-WILL, it wasn't so much that the mall was a corporation but that the actual municipal area is a corporation within a county. If vandals tore apart a tot lot on the "Association" trails the county police needed corporate ok to prosecute. This became an issue the last few years we lived there. About the only true over lap was county property taxes. But then we paid an extra assessment that was not deductible on a federal income tax for extras like trails, parks, pools, and supporting the village center halls plus extra snow removal and lighting. This is above any HOA or condo fees many paid. Then the added cost for a membership that included all amenities such as the pools, tennis courts, gyms and certain reservable park areas. You could also buy a pools only membership. Any business outside the corporation but bordering it could easily call and did the police for HP parking violations. I also had no problem with either our county or the state in getting an intersection near are old house made completely accessible because none of it was considered corporate. But get a home owner to trim his shrubs because I couldn't get past them on the association sidewalk and I got a note that a ride by deemed them within code. I wrote back to invite the advisory board from my village to tour the neighborhood with me and got no answer. By then we knew we were moving so at least the next person only has one group to deal with.
    Courage doesn't always roar. Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying, "I will try again tomorrow."

    Disclaimer: Answers, suggestions, and/or comments do not constitute medical advice expressed or implied and are based solely on my experiences as a SCI patient. Please consult your attending physician for medical advise and treatment. In the event of a medical emergency please call 911.

  6. #16
    Senior Member NW-Will's Avatar
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    I feel you........ I bang my head against the wall for relief.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sue Pendleton View Post
    NW-WILL, it wasn't so much that the mall was a corporation but that the actual municipal area is a corporation within a county. If vandals tore apart a tot lot on the "Association" trails the county police needed corporate ok to prosecute. This became an issue the last few years we lived there. About the only true over lap was county property taxes. But then we paid an extra assessment that was not deductible on a federal income tax for extras like trails, parks, pools, and supporting the village center halls plus extra snow removal and lighting. This is above any HOA or condo fees many paid. Then the added cost for a membership that included all amenities such as the pools, tennis courts, gyms and certain reservable park areas. You could also buy a pools only membership. Any business outside the corporation but bordering it could easily call and did the police for HP parking violations. I also had no problem with either our county or the state in getting an intersection near are old house made completely accessible because none of it was considered corporate. But get a home owner to trim his shrubs because I couldn't get past them on the association sidewalk and I got a note that a ride by deemed them within code. I wrote back to invite the advisory board from my village to tour the neighborhood with me and got no answer. By then we knew we were moving so at least the next person only has one group to deal with.

  7. #17
    Interesting Reading:
    Federal Law on Parking Privileges for
    Persons with Disabilities
    Carol Toland, Legislative Attorney
    American Law Division
    Summary
    http://congressionalresearch.com/RS2...h+Disabilities

    UNIFORM SYSTEM FOR PARKING FOR PERSONS WITH DISABILITIES (adopted by many, but not all states)
    http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/legsregs/dir...pg/cfr1235.htm

    This site goes a long way in describing handicapped parking regulations state by state, NW-Will.
    http://www.fiadisabledtravellers.com...of_america.htm

    All the best,
    GJ

  8. #18
    Senior Member NW-Will's Avatar
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    Thanks.

    Just took a quick look at http://www.fiadisabledtravellers.com...ica/oregon.htm as I am becoming a little too familiar with Portland Oregon rules, these rules do not hold for Portland. There are designated city street wheelchair only marked parking spaces. If you park there with an out of state disabled parking placard that does not designate you as a wheel chair user you will be ticketed. If you're using an out of state placard which doesn't designate you as a wheelchair user at a metered parking spot, you have to pay, just like everyone else (If it's a spot that allows for longer than half an hour and you pay for the full time(eg. max hour spot), you can park for 3 hours).



    Quote Originally Posted by gjnl View Post
    Interesting Reading:
    Federal Law on Parking Privileges for
    Persons with Disabilities
    Carol Toland, Legislative Attorney
    American Law Division
    Summary
    http://congressionalresearch.com/RS2...h+Disabilities

    UNIFORM SYSTEM FOR PARKING FOR PERSONS WITH DISABILITIES (adopted by many, but not all states)
    http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/legsregs/dir...pg/cfr1235.htm

    This site goes a long way in describing handicapped parking regulations state by state, NW-Will.
    http://www.fiadisabledtravellers.com...of_america.htm

    All the best,
    GJ

  9. #19
    Senior Member NW-Will's Avatar
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    Still poking around this subject.

    So far I only know of two states that have distinguishing handicapped parking placards, Oregon and Illinois.

    Looking at the applications for both states is a kind of interesting.

    http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/pu...ions/vsd62.pdf

    http://www.odot.state.or.us/forms/dmv/265fill.pdf

    Turns out the Illinois placard isn't Wheelchair only, but "Meter-Exempt" disabled parking placard. Talk about adding confusion to the mix.


    For Oregon, the form has two boxes Wheelchair and Non-Wheelchair. That a physician then signs.

    Eligibility requirements and additional information:

    Physicians who are authorized to sign the certificate are: Doctors of Medicine, Osteopaths, Podiatrists,
    Chiropractors, Naturopaths, certified Nurse Practitioners and certified Physician Assistants, and licensed
    optometrists.

    801.387 ?Person with a disability.? (1) A person who has severely limited mobility because of paralysis
    or the loss of use of some or all of the person's legs or arms; (2) A person who is affected by loss of vision
    or substantial loss of visual acuity or visual field beyond correction; or (3) A person who has any other
    disability that prevents the person from walking without the use of an assistive device or that causes the
    person to be unable to walk more than 200 feet, including but not necessarily limited to: Chronic heart
    condition; Emphysema; Arthritis; Rheumatism; or Ulcerative colitis or related chronic bowel disorder.

    Wheelchair user disabled person parking permit: A person with a disability, as defined in ORS 801.387,
    and uses a wheelchair or similar low-powered or mechanically propelled vehicle.
    http://www.oregonlaws.org/ors/801.387
    801.387
    Person with a disability

    Person with a disability means:


    (1)
    A person who has severely limited mobility because of paralysis or the loss of use of some or all of the persons legs or arms;


    (2)
    A person who is affected by loss of vision or substantial loss of visual acuity or visual field beyond correction; or


    (3)
    A person who has any other disability that prevents the person from walking without the use of an assistive device or that causes the person to be unable to walk more than 200 feet, including but not necessarily limited to:

    (a)Chronic heart condition;
    (b)Emphysema;
    (c)Arthritis;
    (d)Rheumatism; or
    (e)Ulcerative colitis or related chronic bowel disorder. [Formerly 801.235]

    So being a little cynical I know, but no where in the Oregon code does it really define why you would really need a Wheelchair that would allow you to have a wheelchair placard. If you own a wheelchair and use it anytime throughout the year check the box and have the doctor sign the form, you get the wheelchair placard over the regular disabled placard!!!!!!!

    If they're going to go with a Wheelchair only placard, they could at least go with "If you can not get from your vehicle to five feet away from your vehicle without a wheelchair don't even think about checking this box!"
    I'm sure there is a better way of phrasing this.

    So I telephoned Oregon DMV, and spoke to half a dozen people, it's really amusing, one lady was very adamant you have to be in a wheelchair 95% of the time! Of course nowhere is this documented and after being pushed further up the chain it transpires this is not the case and in fact as long as you can get a doctor to sign the form you get the Wheelchair Only placard. There is not any documentation to assist the doctor except for the definition of what Oregon defines as disabled, so by the letter of the law if you ever have to use a wheelchair the doctor is legitimately able to sign off the Oregon form for the Wheelchair Only placard. And that was from the Oregon DMV disabled driving program department!
    So basically a whole layer of confusion for everyone, that really doesn't seem to accomplish that much!

    Interesting when compared to the Illinois application form!
    From page 2, the criteria for the "Meter-Exempt parking"
    The patient cannot manage, manipulate, or insert coins, or obtain tickets or tokens in parking meters or ticket machines in parking lots due to the lack of fine motor control of BOTH hands.
    The patient cannot reach above his/her head to a height of 42 inches from the ground due to a lack of finger, hand or upper-extremity strength or mobility.
    The patient cannot approach a parking meter due to his/her use of a wheelchair or other device for mobility.
    The patient cannot walk more than 20 feet due to an orthopedic, neurological, cardiovascular or lung condition in which the degree of debilitation is so severe that it almost completely impedes the ability to walk.
    Their colorful placards !
    http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/pu...ons/vsd574.pdf

  10. #20
    Senior Member ~Lin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NW-Will View Post
    So I telephoned Oregon DMV, and spoke to half a dozen people, it's really amusing, one lady was very adamant you have to be in a wheelchair 95% of the time! Of course nowhere is this documented and after being pushed further up the chain it transpires this is not the case and in fact as long as you can get a doctor to sign the form you get the Wheelchair Only placard. There is not any documentation to assist the doctor except for the definition of what Oregon defines as disabled, so by the letter of the law if you ever have to use a wheelchair the doctor is legitimately able to sign off the Oregon form for the Wheelchair Only placard. And that was from the Oregon DMV disabled driving program department!
    Its stuff like this which is why I think education is a big part of the answer. Things need to be more clear, Drs need to understand things better and not sign off on every parking application thats handed to them, those who are applying for a disabled placard need to be educated on proper use of it... Id really like to see people pass a test of some sort before being given the placard, like a quick exam of the laws around using parking placards. I'm not even talking about anything difficult but super simple stuff like ITS ILLEGAL TO PARK IN THE CROSSHATCHING ASSHOLES. Even better would be being required to read and answer questions on disabled parking ettiquette, like its really fucking insensitive to park halfway across the crosshatching because you are too lazy to use a different space or back into the space to have the crosshatching on the side you need it, thereby blocking the person who parked correctly next to the crosshatching on the other side from being able to get back in to their vehicle. (actually it would be nice if it was also illegal to park halfway into the crosshatching, but I'm not familiar with it being like that anywhere.)

    I'd also really like to see the jackass motorcycle drivers who think disabled crosshatching is THEIR parking be towed. I always inform them politely that its illegal, one person even so much as told me he'd discussed it with a police officer and been told it was perfectly fine. The sad part is he probably did. The police need to be educated as well. When people seem resistant to my politeness, I add in that some people will deploy their wheelchair ramps down on top of a motorcycle when its in the way and they really don't want to get their bike messed up. I don't know if anyone has ever done so, but I feel a bit of scare tactics doesn't hurt. Repeat offenders who I see locally I take photos of. Or used to, got burned out. I was going to start some sort of "shame on you indianapolis" blog with all the photos. And I'd take photos of cars parked illegally without anyone in them, or if there was just a passenger inside sometimes. I've gotten into arguments that way which can be scary, but I've also equally scared some people off that way and saw them leave quickly after.
    Board Member of Assistance Dog Advocacy Project working in Education. Feel free to ask me any service dog questions!

    I am not paralyzed. I have a genetic connective tissue disorder with neuro complications and a movement disorder.

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