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Thread: interesting read from ali ingersrol and the kunming walking program

  1. #11
    Did you guys see the part in "surgery details and pictures" about the spinal cord being "frozen" in place and while the Docs were working on freeing the cord it had actually started to pulse again, naturally with breathing and the heart beat? I thought that was very interesting and cool to see.

  2. #12
    So the theory is that if you walk enough (initially with support) eventually function will return as signals re-route etc?

    Have the guys over at Kunming given details of any case studies at all?

    From briefly reading that blog (which is very well written I must say) it appears Ali, despite being there for many months now (or is it years) has recovered no practical walking function at all. Not a great advert for the program.

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by tomsonite View Post
    Intensive rehab absolutely does NOT cure SCI. I agree 100% there. But I do think it offers many health benefits that make people's lives easier. That is why I think we need real research showing the true neurological effects vs. functional or health effects of intensive exercise. As I said previously, I also think it is worth researching what kind of intense rehab will be worth combining with regenerative therapies some day, because I don't think all intensive rehab is created equal.

    I think the 666 program (a name Wise doesn't like anymore, but its just easier to call it that) might be declining in popularity, but I don't think it will "fall" because I think it can be beneficial for incompletes and, as Ali said, acute injuries.

    As far as epidural stimulation, we both know we differ on opinions there. If you haven't already though, I would encourage you to check this thread out:
    http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/showthr...other-s)-talks

    I saw Susan Harkema speak recently, and she talked much more in depth about what the latest going on with epidural stimulation is (as did Reggie Edgerton). There is a lot more data they have yet to publish, or in some cases even analyze. Give it a read, you may find it interesting.
    Thanks for remnding me, it was in my "to read" list.

    See my answer in the other thread.

    Paolo
    In God we trust; all others bring data. - Edwards Deming

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by scisucks View Post
    So the theory is that if you walk enough (initially with support) eventually function will return as signals re-route etc?

    Have the guys over at Kunming given details of any case studies at all?

    From briefly reading that blog (which is very well written I must say) it appears Ali, despite being there for many months now (or is it years) has recovered no practical walking function at all. Not a great advert for the program.
    Yep not a great advert for the program, but I think her blog is very honest and accurate.

    I really admire her for sharing in details her experience.

    Paolo
    In God we trust; all others bring data. - Edwards Deming

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by scisucks View Post
    So the theory is that if you walk enough (initially with support) eventually function will return as signals re-route etc?


    Have the guys over at Kunming given details of any case studies at all?
    Yes, that seems to be the theory. I have never seen any published neurophysiological or functional data at all. If it is out there, I imagine it might be in chinese!

    Quote Originally Posted by scisucks View Post
    From briefly reading that blog (which is very well written I must say) it appears Ali, despite being there for many months now (or is it years) has recovered no practical walking function at all. Not a great advert for the program.
    I've been following her blog from the beginning...she has been there over a year, and from everything I've gathered has not recovered any meaningful function. However, her time rehabbing has been severely limited by a fracture in her leg, pain in her neck from her decompression surgery, and severe neuropathic pain on top of everything else.

    I have also skyped with somebody who is over there with their son, and they told me that the hospital is understaffed and there is such a high demand now that people don't get anywhere close to 6 hours of walking a day. At max, they'll get 2 half-hour sessions of walking a day now. So the "666 program" as most of us know it doesn't really exist right now.

  6. #16
    Her latest blog entry 'kunming walking program overview' is worth reading. A very frank and honest account of the set up over there.


    http://chinaquaddiaries.org/2014/05/...erview-part-1/

  7. #17
    Senior Member lunasicc42's Avatar
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    i took it that locomotor training with no cells (which ali had ) does not produce significant results ,but the purpose of the multiple armed trial will show that cells + locomotor training does ...I thought that was the original point of the trials
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  9. #19
    The latest update from the blog. A must read for anyone who is considering spinal surgery in China.

    http://chinaquaddiaries.org/2014/06/...ery-nightmare/

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