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Thread: Paralysed patients regain voluntary movement with spinal stimulation

  1. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by GRAMMY View Post
    The question in a previous post about sexual function is described elsewhere in relation to the study: The term "sexual function" refers to the ability to sustain a penile erection, have an orgasm (male or female), generate viable sperm, and/or undergo an observable physiological change associated with sexual arousal.
    Hi Grammy,

    Where did you see this? Do you know which of the four patients recovered full sexual function? I can see the Asia B patients recovering orgasm, because they still have some intact sensation, but I find it hard to believe Asia A patients did. The paper did not mention any sensory return. "Sexual function" can mean a variety of different things. Thank you.

  2. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by NWC4 View Post
    Grammy,

    I guess I always assumed return of sensation and/or locomotion would occur or progress a level at a time, but from what I have read these folks seem to have gone from complete to incomplete. From your reading and knowledge would you say it's fair to state they have gone from complete to incomplete?

    Also I have seen no mention of using the US SCI Network for clinical trials. I would have thought this would be perfect opportunity to put it in motion. Any thoughts here?

    I have noy seen Dr. Young comment; is he OUS?

    Thanks!
    SCI Net USA does not exist in reality, it's just a CareCure thread

    The Reeve Foundation has actually set up a clinical trial network callend NACTN (North America Clinical Trial Network). I am not a fun of it, but if you google it you'll find some info., While if you google SCI Net USA you may find nothing.

    Paolo
    In God we trust; all others bring data. - Edwards Deming

  3. #93
    Interesting that you think something isn't real because it doesn't google. You can't find me by googling my real name either, I guess I don't exist.

    Quote Originally Posted by paolocipolla View Post
    SCI Net USA does not exist in reality, it's just a CareCure thread

    The Reeve Foundation has actually set up a clinical trial network callend NACTN (North America Clinical Trial Network). I am not a fun of it, but if you google it you'll find some info., While if you google SCI Net USA you may find nothing.

    Paolo

  4. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Nowhere Man View Post
    From USA Today article:
    "In a response that shocked researchers, all four have regained bladder and bowel control, sexual function and the ability to regulate their blood pressure and body temperature ? even when the epidural stimulation device is not running."

    This does not mean the complete patients could feel their bladders, rectums, or penises (orgasm). That is the most important part of bladder, bowel, and sexual function. In fact, the paper never mentioned any sensation recovery.
    The paper didn't mention any sensation recovery, but it kind of mentioned improved somatosensory function:
    "The somatosensory evoked potentials results in the two AIS-B individuals showing a shorter latency of responses after training may suggest improved somatosensory transmission promoted by repetitive epidural stimulation."

    The paper mentioned at the beginning that they tested somatosensory evoked potentials (SSEPs) in all 4 subjects before, and at multiple points after the implantation and training. The who who were ASIA A had no response, and the two who were ASIA B had a delayed response, as could be expected. There is no reporting of SSEP figures after implantation or training, just the quick little mention of them in the discussion section which I posted above. So all we really can conclude is that the two ASIA B subjects' somatosensory systems were able to get information to their brains better after the study. I'm not sure why they would mention they tested SSEPs at multiple time points and then not present them (the same thing with TMS for that matter).
    This is yet another thing I'll be asking Harkema and/or Edgerton about when I see them.

  5. #95
    Senior Member Imight's Avatar
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    soooooo theres a special going on right now about this on day time tv. whats the deal with this and how can it benefit an incomplete. (let me guess, yet another device that doesnt helps us)

  6. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by Imight View Post
    soooooo theres a special going on right now about this on day time tv. whats the deal with this and how can it benefit an incomplete. (let me guess, yet another device that doesnt helps us)
    One thing is consistently surprising to me is how relative we view our injuries. I mean this in no way to be offensive but to me, I would give my left nut to be incomplete. Hell I would give both of them.

    In fact, when I watched the "My Gimp Life" show (cool show btw), the first thing I thought on the very first episode where I saw her transfer and how low the back of her chair was was "man it must be nice to have that low an injury to have ab muscles and be able to sit up. Silly, huh.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by t8burst View Post
    I mean this in no way to be offensive but to me, I would give my left nut to be incomplete. Hell I would give both of them.
    If it changed my son from a complete to an incomplete, so would I....
    It is amazing how many news articles (written, or on TV) emerge of "walking paras" yet not one story explains that there is a difference between complete and incomplete (and every story that I have seen is about the success of an incomplete). I find it hard to say "yes, but..." when someone mentions the latest miracle news story, and implies that if my son just tried that exercise a bit harder...(which he already has, btw...).
    As per your comment, no offence meant to anyone else!
    Gordon, father of son who became t6 paraplegic at the age of 4 in 2007 as a result of surgery to remove a spinal tumour.

  8. #98
    Senior Member Imight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by t8burst View Post
    One thing is consistently surprising to me is how relative we view our injuries. I mean this in no way to be offensive but to me, I would give my left nut to be incomplete. Hell I would give both of them.

    In fact, when I watched the "My Gimp Life" show (cool show btw), the first thing I thought on the very first episode where I saw her transfer and how low the back of her chair was was "man it must be nice to have that low an injury to have ab muscles and be able to sit up. Silly, huh.
    Yea that show is pretty cool. It was pretty inspiring, she lives out here in hollywood and is doing her thing, and I know it can't be easy, esp in that scene. I enjoyed watching her.

    but arent you a T8 tho? that's pretty low. belly button I believe? I dont think the girl is too far off. when I first got injured I had my back all the way to my shoulder blades ugh. it def restricted my mobility. Im a T4 so at the beginning I had zero core, Ive gained a lot since acute tho.

    I dunno, being incomplete does have its perks, but at the end of the day...im still in a chair

    I always feel like Im just one injection, one inch away from 'making it', like wtf why not test us, and just take us out of our misery. I fully understand why completes are chosen, and I respect it. however, every test always shows very very tiny gains (and then they end the study), those same gains might just get an incomplete to be upright full time. dont scrap the trial , hook US up. I mean for example this test....since we have crossing signals, I bet it could amplify what we already have. possibly get dead signals to cross existing paths.

  9. #99
    Actually I think they do intend to study incompletes with the transcutaneous model for both lower limb and arm/hand in clinical trials that have more sparing than the completes.
    http://spinalcordresearchandadvocacy...otype-for-sci/
    With not having a super sophisticated electrode array, a subcutaneous model for incompletes such as ASIA C & D's may have been WAY TOO much for an incomplete to handle. It was probably best to start the experiments with complete.
    Last edited by GRAMMY; 04-17-2014 at 05:10 PM.

  10. #100
    Senior Member Imight's Avatar
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    yikes

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