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Thread: Two high school...?

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaleB View Post
    I think there's a lot of fertile ground here for an awesome face to face conversation. A message thread, maybe not so much. No desire to argue, but, am very curious (prior to the age of majority) how you can rationally justify minimizing the role, and natural effects, of the parent/child relationship.

    We all come to an age of majority, when we become fully capable of managing our own choices, and their consequences. For some it's quite young, others nurture and feed their neoteny all the way to ripe old age.

    Whatever satanic abuses were laid onto us as children eventually become ours to overcome, true enough, and we each own the capability (acknowledged or not). Blaming parents doesn't adreress anything, either. Blaming anything doesn't, really.

    I've identified the parent/child relationship as the model for all future relationships, as a point of focus, for modifying future outcomes.

    Not as an excuse for my own parental shortcomings, a convenient scape goat for my own personal shortcomings, but as the best way to address the apparent issue of "bad kid".

    Kinda like "bad dogs". Do they really exist?

    What is the evolution of a great parent into a violent, irresponsible child (not yet having attained the age of majority.)?

    I can't fathom one, which doesn't mean one doesn't exist.
    I don't want to argue either. I am not really minimizing the role of good parenting and family life. I think it is extremely important. I have just seen too many times where, despite that, a child goes "bad," that being a relative term.

    A close friend of mine left her first husband after catching him with child porn. She had two children, young, who rarely saw their father growing up. She is very religious, family oriented. Remarried and had two more children. Raised them all...and fast forward 20 years later. Three of the four children turn out great--college grads and the whole bit. The other, the boy from the first marriage, seems fine in all respects, but it turns out he is a child molester--he was caught viewing child porn on the computer and some of the subjects were local.

    Was the son born a child molester? Who knows. Certainly good parenting did not help him. He went to jail for 12 years.

    I have seem lots of other less dramatic cases.

    Sometimes no matter what you do you have a "bad" child.
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  2. #42
    Despite all the nature and nurture never discount the randomn event, A few "lines of bad code" that don't get addressed can completely alter, what otherwise might have been a "good kid".

  3. #43
    Senior Member DaleB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swh2007 View Post
    I don't want to argue either. I am not really minimizing the role of good parenting and family life. I think it is extremely important. I have just seen too many times where, despite that, a child goes "bad," that being a relative term.

    A close friend of mine left her first husband after catching him with child porn. She had two children, young, who rarely saw their father growing up. She is very religious, family oriented. Remarried and had two more children. Raised them all...and fast forward 20 years later. Three of the four children turn out great--college grads and the whole bit. The other, the boy from the first marriage, seems fine in all respects, but it turns out he is a child molester--he was caught viewing child porn on the computer and some of the subjects were local.

    Was the son born a child molester? Who knows. Certainly good parenting did not help him. He went to jail for 12 years.

    I have seem lots of other less dramatic cases.

    Sometimes no matter what you do you have a "bad" child.
    A couple of guys not wanting an argument is a great thing!

    There is certainly a lot we can't account for when it comes to what motivates some people to make choices so out of line with what most folks recognize as nominal enough to ignore. A lot I can't account for, probably a better way of putting that.

    The idea we come into this worldy experience predicated toward one particular individuality, or another, begs so many interesting (to me) questions, I wouldn't know how best to continue.

    Biological, spiritual, cultural, etc.

    Most probably whirling around a notion I hold as true as truth can be recognized, by myself, here and now, and that is "panta rhei". All flows. Including cultures, and their norms, and how adopting certain basic beliefs about existence set the direction a culture is ultimately heading: toward more or less integration of its individuals.

    Bottom lining it, ideals and ideas that serve to dis-integrate people hold less favor, for me, than those than serve to integrate people.

    The existence of random, unstoppably evil, children isn't on my list of ideas that inspire integrity in the people.

    Sadly, even if it's true! One I can live without, in favor of the power of a patient, nurturing, loving, and thoughtful parent.

    I know, I know. I'm a freaking dreamer.


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    Born a child molester? Damn tough question, but I tend toward no.

    Born with certain incentives, one way or another, very possibly, but also with a Mind between capable of being taught to draw inspirations for its ideas and actions from an inner source of integrity (our instinctive awareness of right and wrong).

    Every time I see one of my 4 kids stumble, I hear between my ears a quote from my old Uncle Manly: "I am another yourself."

    I dunno, but, a very rich topic, none the less.
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  4. #44
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    It's nothing to argue about. Like everything else in life, we do our best (as parents) and hope our children wind up being happy, productive, independent, and good people.
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  5. #45
    Senior Member DaleB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swh2007 View Post
    It's nothing to argue about. Like everything else in life, we do our best (as parents) and hope our children wind up being happy, productive, independent, and good people.
    Where there is difference there certainly need not be conflict!

    I personally wonder if there's too much presumption as to what 'doing our best' means, and haste when shrugging our shoulders of any sort of responsibility, as parents. And, since everything is flowing along, constantly changing, more integration along the way would be better than less. And, building up the idea that the transfer of integrity starts at conception and ends at age of majority is a darn good one!

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