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Thread: Going back to long tabs

  1. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Axle View Post
    I was talking about my speed control and braking technique. As I descend toward the bottom of the grade I increase my wheelie to slow down and ultimately stop with one last wheelie burst. It is not uncommon that I am in a wheelie all the way down, just to varying degrees. Steep wheelie is the only possible way to go down a steep grade.
    I took the Surge rims on my awaited TR3, so I will review them end of March.

    I suspect that your chair requires you to descend in a wheelie because frame is not deep enough, RSH is not low enough and you use 4" casters.
    On my chair, I rarely descend in a wheelie cause I can go faster on 4 wheels and if I have to, I wear gloves so I think wheelie will not be an issue with Surge rims.

  2. #52
    Senior Member jschism's Avatar
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    probably Ti-lites problem, too

  3. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Axle View Post
    I was talking about my speed control and braking technique. As I descend toward the bottom of the grade I increase my wheelie to slow down and ultimately stop with one last wheelie burst. It is not uncommon that I am in a wheelie all the way down, just to varying degrees. Steep wheelie is the only possible way to go down a steep grade.
    An alternative to doing a wheelie is to "slalom" down a steep grade. The zigs and the zags are less steep.

  4. #54
    Senior Member Axle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big View Post
    I took the Surge rims on my awaited TR3, so I will review them end of March.

    I suspect that your chair requires you to descend in a wheelie because frame is not deep enough, RSH is not low enough and you use 4" casters.
    Let me clarify. At lower grades you have the option of 2 or 4 wheels. At a somewhat steep grade, 2 wheels are more efficient than 4. At the steepest grades, especially with irregular surface, it is not possible to use 4 wheels, regardless of chair configuration. That would be off-road terrain. A good example is an embankment.

  5. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Axle View Post
    At a somewhat steep grade, 2 wheels are more efficient than 4.
    What do you mean? On 2 wheels you can only brake, on 4 wheels you can be more active. Look at wheelchairs in skate parks.

  6. #56
    Senior Member Axle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~Lin View Post
    If I'm picturing this correctly, where do you push to if thats where you grab the tire??
    Because I am sitting so far forward, I push the wheel between 11:30 and 10:30 o'clock indoors. Yes it is a short stroke, but my chair is light and bearings are in good condition so I can go far with one short stroke. Besides, how far are you going indoors before turning that you would ever need a long stroke?

    Outdoors, I extend that range from 12 to 9 o'clock on level surface, which is long enough to be efficient. Uphill, I am leaning forward so the range over which I push would be more along the front of the wheel. Efficiency does go down. But it does for everyone uphill, regardless of where they clench the wheel.


    Quote Originally Posted by ~Lin View Post
    I read and was told to grab as far back as possible then bring your arms up and down then let go and swing your arms back to grab again, sort of tracing a circle with your hands for the most efficient push and easiest on the shoulders.
    I agree about the circular motion. With longer strokes outdoors, my hands travel half the wheel, from 3 to 9 o'clock, and my elbows extend fully between strokes. But I don't like to clench the wheel behind my hips. Because that forces me to twist (and stress) my wrists to the max. Depending on how you sit it may also force you to shrug (and stress) your shoulders.

    If you push along the front of the wheel, your wrists can remain in a neutral position for the entire stroke, and your shoulder too depending on how you sit. Basically, I want to push with my triceps and forearms and leave my shoulders and wrists out of it. Of course being able to do such a stroke requires sitting high and forward.
    Last edited by Axle; 02-09-2013 at 05:20 PM.

  7. #57
    Senior Member Axle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big View Post
    What do you mean? On 2 wheels you can only brake, on 4 wheels you can be more active. Look at wheelchairs in skate parks.
    Skate parks are specially designed to keep going. In real life, you have to stop at the bottom.

    I hear what you are saying. But that is an exception. For most cases in real life, I wish to decelerate downhill. Control over the full handrail helps do this, wheelie or no wheelie.

    Point is that Surge forfits thumb control, which is a big compromise. You can regain that thumb control by installing the thumb piece. But then you have to do the pinching motion in order to avoid contact and burn with the rubber strip. That is less control than cupping with the entire hand. Besides, I want to avoid pinching with my fingers because of RSIs.
    Last edited by Axle; 02-09-2013 at 04:55 PM.

  8. #58
    Senior Member Axle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jschism View Post
    probably Ti-lites problem, too
    Gald you remembered. TiLite, DME, Ride and I are all working together toward a solution.

  9. #59
    Senior Member Axle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big View Post
    I took the Surge rims on my awaited TR3, so I will review them end of March.

    I suspect that your chair requires you to descend in a wheelie because frame is not deep enough, RSH is not low enough and you use 4" casters.
    On my chair, I rarely descend in a wheelie cause I can go faster on 4 wheels and if I have to, I wear gloves so I think wheelie will not be an issue with Surge rims.
    In general, regardless of whose chair we are talking about, you don't want your front casters to fall into holes or strike tall bumps. Sometimes you don't see these holes or bumps until you are upon them. Response time is key. I would not want to compromise even the smallest response time. I think the surge would compromise response time.

    Here is an every day example. Just going down my driveway, here are all the transitions that are obstacles for front casters.

    driveway to sidewalk
    sidewalk to curb
    curb to gutter
    gutter to road

    Going from 4" to 5" casters or going from a 14" to 16" wheelbase doesn't overcome these obstacles. The best option may be a wheelie. I am certain that surge will compromise wheelie control. It's just a question of how much. I am interested in hearing your experience.

  10. #60
    Senior Member ~Lin's Avatar
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    How can you be "certain" about something you've never even tried?
    Board Member of Assistance Dog Advocacy Project working in Education. Feel free to ask me any service dog questions!

    I am not paralyzed. I have a genetic connective tissue disorder with neuro complications and a movement disorder.

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