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Thread: Contacting the patients who received laserponcture

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Cosne sur Loire
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    249

    Contacting the patients who received laserponcture

    Some of you asked Wise to quantify / qualify the results of the patients you saw on video and are interested to know their condition before and after treatment. We can give you their email address if you wish to get in touch with them.
    It's possible to keep our fees low thanks to the support by a French government grant financing the laser up to 75%; the remaining 25% are paid by the clinic. The laser is made and put together by one of the most famous French engineering school according to my specifications.
    Also the Healing Therapies newsletter (www.healingtherapies.info) focused on laserponcture this month - you need to signe up to receive it.
    Albert

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    French:

    Comme certains ont demande a Wise de quantifier / qualifier les progres des patients qu'ils ont vu en video pour savoir quel etait leur etat avant le traitement, nous pouvons vous donner l'email de chacun si vous desirez les contacter. Nous pratiquons des tarifs bas car le financement du laser est finance a 75% par le gouvernement francais au titre de la recherche ; les 25% restants sont a la charge de la clinique. C'est une des plus grandes ecoles d'ingenieurs qui fabriquent ce laser sur mon cahier des charges.
    La newsletter de Healing Therapies www.healingtherapies.info. Vous pourrez y acceder en vous y abonnant.
    Albert

  2. #2
    Albert, it is not a good idea for me to give my opinion regarding the recovery of people who received the laserponcture therapy, since I did not see them before or after. I am glad if they believe that they are recovering some function. As you and others know, some recovery can occur in people even years after injury, especially when coupled with strong motivation to exercise and some treatment. The only rigorous comparison will come from people randomized to the therapy and no therapy under similar circumstances. Wise.

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Cosne sur Loire
    Posts
    249
    Wise,

    Thanks for posting. We have been asking for this randomisation to international authorities for years and years. We did even ask the Nobel committee to appoint a committee of international experts in 1993. The answer we had at the time was that the Nobel committee's goal was not to perform evaluations.

    No research team or university offered to do a randomized study in order to evaluate the objectivity of the laserponcture benefits and its results, as was the case between 1987 and 1992 when a study was done to test the laserponcture action on pain over more than 700 individuals; the study was performed at the Centre Hospitalier Universitaire Regional in Lyon Sud. We know that as long as the randomization is not done, laserponcture will be questionable. But it's the SCI community that will suffer from this situation: research is delayed because of the lack of financing in this field. And it�s difficult to make up for lost time.
    It's a scientific and economical debate. I've never refused to publish my results or discuss contradiction and you know it.

    The natural recovery in injured individuals several years after SCI may be favoured by a special climate at my clinic or is it my charming smile which helps the recovery? . But that's not scientific and a randomized study is necessary. Don't you think so?

    Our only option is to present our works and give the email of the patients � after they gave us their agreement � so that they could explain their condition before and after treatment.

    We do agree with a randomized study that will or will not show the laserponcture efficiency.

    We could say that the group which received laserponcture is the test group and the group which did not receive it is the passive group. But that's not really scientific, realistic or serious.

    In conclusion, what can we say of the immediate recoveries post olfactive cells transplantation? Are they natural? Or can we claim it's due to the transplantation? But when and according to which criteria can the recoveries be attributed to the transplantation since there are no more rules to quantify them and they seem natural. Why looking for a treatment then?

    Albert

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    French:

    Wise,

    Merci de votre message. Il y a des annees que nous demandons cette randomisation devant les grandes instances internationales. Nous avons m�me demand� au comite Nobel en 1993 de nommer un comite deexperts international. Il nous a ete repondu que ce n'etait pas l'objectif du comite Nobel de pratiquer une telle evaluation.
    Aucune equipe ou universite ne s'est proposee pour faire une etude randomisee pour evaluer l'objectivite des apports du laserponcture et ses resultats comme cela avait ete fait pour l'action du laserponcture sur la douleur au CHUR de Lyon Sud entre 1987 et 1992 sur plus de 700 patients. Nous savons que tant que cette randomisation ne sera pas faite, le laserponcture sera sujet a caution, et tant que cette randomisation ne sera pas faite pour montrer l'action du laserponcture, ce seront les blesses medullaires qui en souffriront car le retard pris dans le financement d'equipes travaillant dans le meme sens ne se rattrapera pas.
    C'est un debat a la fois scientifique et economique. Je n'ai jamais refuse de publier mes resultats ni la contradiction, vous le savez bien.
    Peut-etre nait-il un climat autour de la clinique qui favorise la recuperation naturelle bien des annees apres la blessure medullaire et que mon sourire charmeur permet aux blesses medullaires de recuperer des fonctions . Mais tout cela n'est pas tres scientifique et effectivement une etude randomisee s'impose. Ne croyez-vous pas ?
    Nous sommes obliges de presenter nos travaux et donner l'email des personnes qui ont accepte pour qu'ils puissent decrire leur etat anterieur et confirmer leur etat actuel.
    Nous ne sommes pas opposes � une �tude randomisee pour montrer l�efficacite ou la non-efficacite du laserponcture.
    On pourrait dire que ceux qui ont recu le laserponcture jusqu'a present sont le groupe temoin et que ceux qui ne l'ont pas recu sont le groupe passif. Mais ca n'est pas tres scientifique ni realiste ni s�rieux.

    En conclusion, que dire des recuperations immediates post implantation des cellules olfactives. Sont-elles naturelles ? Peut-on les attribuer a l'implantation ? Et a partir de quel moment et sur quels criteres ces recuperations peuvent-elles etre attribuees aux cellules olfactives ? Puisqu'il n'y a plus de regle pour quantifier les recuperations et qu'elles semblent etre toutes naturelles, pourquoi chercher un traitement ?

    Albert

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