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Thread: Comparison of FES US/Vienna

  1. #1
    Senior Member poonsuzanne's Avatar
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    Comparison of FES US/Vienna

    1. Stimulette den2x from Vienna has just been launched by the manufacturing company, Dr. Schuffried Medizintechnik GMBH, exclusively for denervated muscles. Dr. Helmut Kern's team in Vienna will test the device with patients first in the next 6 months before they will prescribe the device to out-patients.

    Power : 110V output/300mA, Bithasic Current

    Size of electrodes : 16 x 12.8cm (gel will be applied on the electrodes before treatment)

    2 Channel unit : each channel with 2 electrodes, 2 electrodes for each side of quadriceps. Therefore, 2 channels can stimulate both quads at the same time for a 30 minutes treatment. Totally, 4-5 areas to be stimulated in the lower extremities. Approx. 2.5-3 hours a day.



    2. Neurocare 1000 from US, FDA approved, www. neurocare.com

    Power : 440V A/C output/4.4mA

    Size of electrodes : 2" x 4" (no gel is required, only use water to wet the electrodes)

    4 Channel unit : each channel with 2 electrodes, 3 treatments per day, 45 minutes for each treatment; treatment program will be designed by the clinician according to individual case.

    Mr. Tom Oliver of Neurocare said that one of the benefits of the stimulation is that it can reduce inflammation of the injury by putting electrodes above and below the injury site on the legs. He offered me a testing fee of $300, plus $350 one month rental & DHL charges.



    Wildwilly, since Stimulette den2x will not be available in the next 6 months, I want my son to try out the Neurocare 1000. But I am concerned about the high current output whether it might be harmful. More importantly, whether it is able to provoke muscle contractions. If Neurocare 1000 is not an option for my son, I might consider RT300-SL Leg Cycle from Restorative Therapies, stimulation up to 200V output/140 mA , 10 channel unit which can stimulate up to 10 muscle group in one or both of your legs and your trunk. www.restorative-therapies.com. Thank you so much for all of the inputs in the previous posts! I will also look up the http://www.ottobock.com/cps/rde/xbcr...4_brochure.pdf.

    Quote Originally Posted by wildwilly View Post
    I have never used that actual unit. In theory you should be able to stimulate denervated muscle given the unit has the parameters, "In order to be effective a stimulator for activation of denervated skeletal muscles via surface electrodes requires biphasic long-duration impulses with a pulse width between 10 and 300ms and amplitudes of up to ± 100 V respectively ± 250 mA. These demands rise safety issues in the design and application of both the stimulator and the electrodes" (http://www.bio.unipd.it/bam/PDF/12-6/02504Mayr.pdf).

    The main safety issues are tissue damage (burning the skin). AC current helps reduce the risk (anode and cathode alternate so no net build up of acidic/basic conditions under the surface electrode). It is very important to make sure you use the appropriate size electrode electrode (current density is directionally proportional to electrode size, ie cut the electrode in half, double the density, possible tissue damage). Not trying to scare anyone but it is possible to irritate and/or burn skin with AC current if you try hard enough.

    I did trial a new 4 channel unit from Otto Bock the other day. What I liked about it was the fact that the FES can be set up to be EMG activated. This is not new but their unit was more sensitive (in regards to EMG) and user friendly. Please see the link for more details (http://www.ottobock.com/cps/rde/xbcr...4_brochure.pdf).

    I like having the EMG activated FES capability. It gives more treatment options.
    Quote Originally Posted by wildwilly View Post
    You have to be much more careful with direct current (DC). You are much more likely to burn and/or damage skin/tissue with longer treatment times or higher amperage (mA). In, general, alternating current (AC) is much safer. You should trial the unit before agreeing to purchase. Most companies/dealers are willing to provide a trial.

    As for NMES (neuro muscular electrical stimulation) and FES (functional electrical stimulation) they are the same thing (along with TENs transcutaneous electrical nerve stimulation). NMES, FES, and TENs are all transcutaneous (across the skin). The only difference is the parameters.
    Last edited by poonsuzanne; 12-08-2010 at 10:49 AM.
    Suzanne

  2. #2
    Senior Member lynnifer's Avatar
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    I thought your son was using some high-powered FES from Vienna that was in trials? It's no longer in trials anymore?

    I ask because Richard was like me - completely flaccid with no reaction to FES. It was my understanding that they had to use larger areas to conduct but the risk was burning the skin?

    (Good to see you still working hard for the cure, Suzanne - and still around CareCure! Hope Richard is doing well - last I heard he was in BC at school?)
    Roses are red. Tacos are enjoyable. Don't blame immigrants, because you're unemployable.

    T-11 Flaccid Paraplegic due to TM July 1985 @ age 12

  3. #3
    Senior Member poonsuzanne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lynnifer View Post
    I thought your son was using some high-powered FES from Vienna that was in trials? It's no longer in trials anymore?

    I ask because Richard was like me - completely flaccid with no reaction to FES. It was my understanding that they had to use larger areas to conduct but the risk was burning the skin?

    (Good to see you still working hard for the cure, Suzanne - and still around CareCure! Hope Richard is doing well - last I heard he was in BC at school?)
    Hi Lynnifer

    The device from Vienna can provoke visible muscle contractions during stimulation. But like I said one has to spend almost 3 hours a day to benefit from the stimulation in building muscle bulk. Also, if you do it correctly it will not burn your skin.

    Richard Jr. graduated from UBC in Vancouver two years ago and has been working since then. He is now in Guangzhou representing HK to participate in the Asian Paralympic Games in wheelchair basketball. Thanks for remembering my son! You are a valuable member in this Forum.
    Suzanne

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