Page 11 of 207 FirstFirst ... 2345678910111213141516171819202161111 ... LastLast
Results 101 to 110 of 2063

Thread: Microcyn Bladder Treatment (An Open Letter to Dr. Young)

  1. #101
    Senior Member WPDaggy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Riverside, CA.
    Posts
    116
    Have you tried flushing your bladder with it yet, as JenJen has done, with great success according to her?

  2. #102
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Montreal, Canada
    Posts
    1,268
    Lazlo,

    I had made some research too about the company and the composition of the product but I had not yet spoken about it here. Yes, it looks like pH adjusted diluted bleach but as someone else mentioned here, it has a good shelf life which is important, since this kind of solution usually deteriorates fast. Unfortunately, I can't find the rate at which an identical solution would usually degrade. I am yet to find what is so special (or not) about Microcyn based solutions that makes them more stable, allowing them to keep the right ratio of chlorine species at neutral pH over long periods of time.

    The active ingredients of Microcyn based solutions (Vetericyn, Dermacyn) are hypochlorous acid (HOCl @ 0,0025% or 25 ppm) and hypochlorite (OCl- 0,0036% or 36 ppm) at low concentrations with a pH around 7,2 (quite neutral). The graph below shows the relation between pH and the fraction of each chlorine specie, the higher the pH (alkaline), the more hypochlorite (bleach) you get which is not good since less efficient at killing bacteria than hypochlorous acid for a given concentration and more toxic to human cells. The graph is from the website of a company selling apparatus (Sterilox by PuiriCore) to make such solutions.

    Again, there is nothing new here, this is not an innovative mechanism of action. It has been known for awhile that hypochlorous acid (HOCl), which is true is also used by neutrophils (a type of white blood cells), kills bacteria.

    I would also point out that it is also known (even if contested by some) that even chlorinated water, despite free chlorine concentrations of only 0,2 to 4 ppm at the tap, is linked to an increase of bladder cancer (either by drinking it or through skin absorption or inhalation when showering). Now someone will probably say that is the chlorinated by-products (CBP*) that are responsible for that increase and not the free chlorine which is probably true, but it still makes me cautious.

    *When chlorine is used to treat water, it doesn't disappear, but produces hundreds of new compounds, now known as Chlorinated-By-Products, or CBP's. CBP's form when chlorine reacts with "natural organic matter" in the water. This "natural organic matter" includes sewage, soil, plant material, manure eroding from pasture and range lands, commercial fertilizers, algae, and pesticide runoff.
    Last edited by JGNI; 04-23-2010 at 10:32 PM. Reason: info on Sterilox
    Pharmacist, C4-5 injury but functional C6 (no triceps/flexors)

  3. #103
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Montreal, Canada
    Posts
    1,268
    I emailed Oculus, asking what makes their solution more stable and I am waiting for an answer. Another interesting table:
    Last edited by JGNI; 04-23-2010 at 10:26 PM. Reason: Added info
    Pharmacist, C4-5 injury but functional C6 (no triceps/flexors)

  4. #104
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Montreal, Canada
    Posts
    1,268
    Well I got an "answer" by email just now:

    Thank you for your inquiry regarding our Microcyn Technology’s stability.

    We’ve spent approximately $150M USD from the founding of the company in 1999 to date, completed 32+ clinical trials around the world and are launching prescription and over-the-counter products in wound care, dermatology, the surgical suite, animal health and oral care. Our technology is patent protected by 11 issued patents and 140+ pending applications. Part of our intellectual property portfolio covers our unique stability, so my apologies for not describing in detail our methods of stabilizing our unique and proprietary compound.


    To which I replied:

    I thought that since it was protected by patents you could have given me minimal info as to what is involved in the stabilization.


    And the second answer was:

    Our Founder and CEO likes to tease that although Microcyn Technology is patent protected, we don't share our formulation, methods of manufacturing or stability methods even with close family members.

    Thanks for your understanding


    Pharmacist, C4-5 injury but functional C6 (no triceps/flexors)

  5. #105
    Senior Member CapnGimp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Alpine, TX USA male T4complete
    Posts
    3,471
    Blog Entries
    1
    And you were suprised by their reaction/statement?

    Well, years ago when we were discussing it, I couldn't locate suppliers or I would have had it then. I have heard bladder cancer til I'm sick of it. MOST of what ails the population is due to improper lifestyle. Correct that and the immune system works very well to protect us from all this disease and sickness that is now commonplace and thought of as inevitable. I almost got on a soapbox again. But I refuse now. The information is out there for those who desire the truth and are desiring a good quality, long life. I was scoped recently and the doctor exclaimed as he looked that my bladder was in better shape than his, except for being neurogenic. I realize everyone isn't going to be as dedicated as me, but over 10 years as a vegan was validated by my checkup.
    This stuff works, it's in my toolkit. I used it today after a mean burn on my leg. Damn coffee, or rather, damn worthless cup.
    Blistered and some of them burst and I've yet to look at it since this morning when I bandaged it. After a shower I sprayed it with vetericyn, put Tepezcohuite salve on it and a thin piece of gauze. Haven't did this since early on...scarred me then and took a few months to heal. We'll compare it now after it heals.

    I guess the utube videos were not viewed by the questioning folks. Anyway, I will tell folks when I can, but like everything else, that's all you can do.

    My bro in laws dad took my cat to the vet(new cat) short story... they got abx for a foot wound. I am not using them, I have maJik wawa.

    I am thankful Leila started this thread and gave us the info. I wouldn't care if she WERE a salesman for the company, she can knock on MY door anytime.


    JGNI and BOBKAT.... rem ember this?
    http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/showthread.php?t=63447

    POOF !! There ya go BOB.. did ya get any yet or r u gonna continue with H2O2 ? It's worked flawlessly so far n is a lot cheaper.
    Last edited by CapnGimp; 04-24-2010 at 12:21 AM.

  6. #106
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Montreal, Canada
    Posts
    1,268
    Hi Capn,

    I am not sure about the tone of your reply, do you think I am against the use of Microcyn based solutions?

    As for being surprised about their reaction, were you sarcastic, meaning that I should know better than expect an explanation as to why their solution is stable? I get answers from pharmaceutical companies all the time as to why their products acts like this or that, they have nothing to fear if they have a patent on the process. We are not talking about the details of the "how to" here, just the gist of it would have been enough to enlighten us.

    As to the thread you are referring to, thanks for reminding me about it, I just went back to it and saw that some posted other comments after my last one (May 25th, 2006!), I was not even aware of those. But where do you want to go by bringing that thread? Is it about when Bob was asking if a safer solution than peroxide could be found to flush the bladder?

    Anyway, when I talk about being cautious, I am not talking about some flushes to get rid of an infection but about daily use. I am just saying that it's hard to know what 20 years of irrigation with that could bring. Again, 20 years of being infected is no better ... so everyone pick his own poison

    BTW, although I am a pharmacist, I am not on the side of "big pharma", I don't profit from the sale of drugs (working in public long term care and happy to save on my budget when I can).
    Pharmacist, C4-5 injury but functional C6 (no triceps/flexors)

  7. #107
    Senior Member Leila's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Eureka, Caifornia
    Posts
    441
    Hi everyone,

    Can't say much right now--preparing for a trip to San Francisco so our son can see the specialist.

    I have contacted a microbiologist/chemist with expertise in microcyn technology. He stated that there is no similarity between microcyn and either diluted bleach or chlorinated water. Tests done on human tissue exposed to microcyn showed elevated levels of oxygen, but no chlorine or cpb's.

    Worrying about getting bladder cancer by using microcyn is like worrying about getting struck by lightening if you go outside on a sunny day.

    And I am NOT a sales rep.

    There's more to tell,

    Leila

  8. #108
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Montreal, Canada
    Posts
    1,268
    Quote Originally Posted by Leila View Post
    Worrying about getting bladder cancer by using microcyn is like worrying about getting struck by lightening if you go outside on a sunny day.
    Hi Leila, just saying so doesn't make it so. I have no good reason beside what I said to fear bladder cancer from using it on a daily basis, but what facts do you have to always be so assertive in your comments. Come on, I am happy to use it and learn about it, but just saying don't worry it's just fine is not going to convince anyone that want facts. And if you read what I wrote, I never said it was ONLY diluted bleach, please.

    I am just tired of hearing it's very different and so on. How is it so different, bring on the chemist. We want to learn, does it have any active ingredients beside what I stated?
    Pharmacist, C4-5 injury but functional C6 (no triceps/flexors)

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by JGNI View Post
    Our technology is patent protected by 11 issued patents and 140+ pending applications. Part of our intellectual property portfolio covers our unique stability, so my apologies for not describing in detail our methods of stabilizing our unique and proprietary compound.
    This is a big red flag to me. If they are adding a preservative to stabilize the formula, I'd want to know exactly what that preservative is. And like you said, if they've patented the technique, they are protected. Will they provide us with the patent numbers? If so, we can just look up the patents at http://uspto.gov . The patent numbers might even be listed on their packaging. I'd be quite interested to see them. If the patents are pending we should at least be allowed to know at least what the title of the patent is, given that we're using their product to treat our bodies!

    If they won't willingly provide the patent numbers via email that's a huge sign to me that there is something fishy with their formulation.

  10. #110
    no patent # on the labeling of vetericyn but after the results I have experienced I have no fear of using it...as far as ingredients listed...electrolyzed water (h20)(99.97%),sodium chloride (NaCI)(0.023%), sodium hypochlorite (NaOCI)(O.004%) &hypochlorous acid (HOCI)
    (0.003%)....typed as written on the label...

    Leila, I hope I didn't offend with my sales rep remark, that was not what I intended...you just had so much info...I appreciate you posting this very much! Have a safe trip and I pray your son improves... Seeing what it has done for jen jen and CapnGimp gave me the courage to give it a try!

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •