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Thread: Do Fish Feel Pain?

  1. #41
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    Fish anesthetized in large quantities

    http://www.times-standard.com/localnews/ci_10962529

    The council adopted significantly different means of managing trawl fishing that it says will reduce waste and be safer and more profitable for fishermen.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by orangejello View Post
    That is what I used to believe. I tried it once on a sick fish and it completely traumatized me. Afterwards I spoke to a vet and he said told me he didn't believe freezing was humane unless the fish was heavily anesthetized first and even then he had doubts. He recommended that I use a fish anesthetic called Finquel, doubling the regular dose that would be used to anesthetize a given fish, and that would provide the most humane death. I have since done it this way several times and never had a problem. Well except that emotionally I find it is a very tough thing to do. It does seem the most human way to me as the fish simply loose consciousness and then their hearts stop. I guess freezing does that too but I could never do that again and believe it doesn't cause the fish a lot of stress, even if momentarily.
    OJ,
    I'm knocking on wood and hoping to avouid the freezer and the Finquel, but TYVM for the tip.
    Rose
    http://www.myspace.com/roseoremus
    C6/C7 Complete, Asia A, since March 31, 2005.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Timaru View Post
    Thank you for that I'll try it on the next Conger Eel I catch, I'd almost concluded Congers had discovered the secret of immortality.



    This video shows the difference between the way an American (Italian?) chef and how a Japanese chef prepares an eel. This video is not for the squeamish.

    Wise.

  4. #44
    Can we agree on at least the following criteria for pain?

    1. Pain requires a functioning brain. While a decapitate body may flop around and show pain reflexes, most of us would not consider such movements to be indicative of "pain". These are reflexes. By the way, if we accept this perspective, this means that a blastocyst (which does not have a brain) cannot feel pain. An amputated arm, even though it might be alive cannot feel pain.

    2. You can have pain without sensory input. In other words, you can imagine pain and the brain itself can create painful sensations without any noxious incoming sensation. So, pain is really a phenomenon of the brain. A body without a brain cannot feel pain. A brain without a body can feel pain.

    3. A significant part of pain is memory. Pain is a transitory phenomenon. Memory not only records the presence of the pain but also emotional response to pain. If you cannot remember that you had the pain or your emotional response to the pain, it would not have the same effect. The full effect of pain requires memory.

    Wise.

  5. #45
    Senior Member Timaru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wise Young View Post


    This video shows the difference between the way an American (Italian?) chef and how a Japanese chef prepares an eel. This video is not for the squeamish.

    Wise.
    The first demonstrator is Frank Bradley,

    http://www.frozenfishdirect.co.uk/about.html

    a well known London fish monger, eccentric and amateur racing driver who must have filleted thousands of eels but the Japanese chef is in a class of his own and I would love to sample one of his dishes.
    Last edited by Timaru; 11-13-2008 at 06:08 PM. Reason: spelling

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Timaru View Post
    The first demonstrator is Frank Bradley,

    http://www.frozenfishdirect.co.uk/about.html

    a well known London fish monger, eccentric and amateur racing driver who must have filleted thousands of eels but the Japanese chef is in a class of his own and I would love to sample one of his dishes.
    Thanks. The sign of the restaurant says Bradley's. I do like the Japanese way of filleting the eel. It was impressively fast, allowing the filets to be rapidly deboned. Note that while he cuts the head, he does not detach the head completely.

    Wise.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Wise Young View Post
    How wonderful that you are involved with a koi and a KOI CLUB! Perhaps Nishikigoi should be named mydear. I was just at a Samurai's house called Nomura-san's House in Kanazawa (Japan). They have these monstrous koi's that must be 30-40 lb, perhaps 2.5 feet long, and 6-inches in diameter, lazing in the pond. Nishiki means "brocaded" and koi means carp. I am reminded of the huge carps that are in the imperial moat in Tokyo. As kids, we use to toss mikan (tangerine) slices to them.
    Wise.

    Dr. Wise,

    Your trip to Japan sounds awesome. I would have liked to go just to see more koi. I had to look up the word samurai, military nobility, as opposed to what my mind was thinking, superior swordsman Ninja, or it could be the same. I'm assuming this is a friend and not a tourist attraction, as it didn't get any hits when I searched google. Either way, it sounds like a great trip. Iam jealous.

    Would you mind confirming or denying my claims to a japanese translation, if you could. I thought I had read that ochiba shigure meant "rain on falling leaves." I have since seen this, "
    The Japanese breeders often name the Koi after things that
    they like. Ochiba Shigure, for example, means "leaves fallen on the water."
    I like my translation better. haha. stubborn girl. It's a beautiful fish, but has proven to be bad luck for me 2x. I know that someday I will miss having the priviledge of owning a koi pond.

    After that video, I will not be eating eels anytime soon either, but it was pretty interesting.
    Rose
    http://www.myspace.com/roseoremus
    C6/C7 Complete, Asia A, since March 31, 2005.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Sasyrose2 View Post
    Dr. Wise,

    Your trip to Japan sounds awesome. I would have liked to go just to see more koi. I had to look up the word samurai, military nobility, as opposed to what my mind was thinking, superior swordsman Ninja, or it could be the same. I'm assuming this is a friend and not a tourist attraction, as it didn't get any hits when I searched google. Either way, it sounds like a great trip. Iam jealous.

    Would you mind confirming or denying my claims to a japanese translation, if you could. I thought I had read that ochiba shigure meant "rain on falling leaves." I have since seen this, "
    The Japanese breeders often name the Koi after things that
    they like. Ochiba Shigure, for example, means "leaves fallen on the water."
    I like my translation better. haha. stubborn girl. It's a beautiful fish, but has proven to be bad luck for me 2x. I know that someday I will miss having the priviledge of owning a koi pond.

    After that video, I will not be eating eels anytime soon either, but it was pretty interesting.
    Nomura's house is a minor tourist attraction in Kanazawa. It is the house in Kanazawa where the Nomura family lived for ten generations (Source). Below is a picture that I took of the Koi at the Nomura House.

    According to http://www.pokoi.com/kg-ochiba.html, the Ochiba Shigure means "dead leaves floating in water", referring to grey and brown koi, made by breeding Chagoi with Soragoi (Source). The word "ochiba" does mean "fallen leaves". However, I do't know the meaning of the word "shigure". It has implications of rain but is the name of several characters in Japanese anime and other stories (Source), including a female ninja and a demon surgeon. It is also the name of a Japanese Destroyer (ship) in World War II. Here is a picture of Shigure from the Hidden Rain Village in the Naruto anime series:


    I prefer your translation.

    Wise.
    Last edited by Wise Young; 11-15-2008 at 02:46 PM.

  9. #49
    Banned adi chicago's Avatar
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    Nice fish sir ...are they carp?I watched a documentary on Discovery Channel regarding carp and gene mutations.Cool colors .
    • Dum spiro, spero.
      • Translation: "As long as I breathe, I hope."

  10. #50
    One new question here Doc. If I catch a fish and take a knife and stick it in the back or body of that fish and it jerks, wouldn't you consider that pain??

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