Voc Rehab Catch 22

[skippy13]

So, I get this ticket to work thingy in the mail. I am on SSDI and think this is a great thing, they can help me get back to work, right? I need to get back to work. I am broke. I paid for two neurosurgeries out of my own pocket last year in addition to 7500 dollars in complications from one of them that I couldn't really afford. I had no insurance since I could'nt return to my job, and have been off a long time due to a series of surgeries and recoveries. I applied for and got SSDI and had a long term disability plan that somehow cancelled me. (the cheatin' bastards)

I am tetraparetic due to severe spinal stenosis and a fall in July of 2006. Means I am a walking quad. (Sort of walking anyway, I can walk, but balance is terrible and I have weakness in the legs that make any distance impossible and very quad hands and arms)

So I go through the initial interview and get my appointment with the folks at the state voc rehab office. I go to the appointment and the woman was really not trying to help me in any way. She said she cannot help me until I can improve my mobility by getting a wheelchair. I said I can't get one without a job, since I no longer have any money. Catch-22. No job, no wheelchair...no wheelchair, no job. She would'nt even take my application for services from me.

So, OK, I make another appointment hoping to get another worker this time. No such luck. Same gal. I tell her I cannot get a wheelchair because I have no money and if I don't get a job soon I will likely end up homeless. No shit, truth. She jumps up and says we cant help you if you are homeless, that is another agency and then runs out of the room.

I stop at the counter on the way out of the place and make an appt to see the boss. I go to this appt with MR. Muck-e-muck, and he tells me that since I am not medically stable they cant help me at this time. OK, so since I still have no insurance (a year and a half till medicrap kicks in) I cant get medically stable.

My question is...What the hell?:thinking:

[LaMemChose]

If a chair is needed for you to return to work, ask VR to pay for the chair you need. Put your request in writing and submit it to your caseworker, her supervisor and his supervisor. Follow up with phone calls and an appointment. Meet with her and/or him about what you need.

VR should help provide the resources you need to return to work and/or school. A chair is not out of the question if that is the difference in you working or being unemployed.

If you are denied a chair or an opportunity to develop a plan through VR, raise hell. Go to the media if you must, but only after you have exhausted all other resources.

You might also try other agencies for help getting a chair. You may wish to contact Catholic Charities, especially if you are Catholic. You may also wish to contact Easter Seals and United Cerebral Palsy. UCP has begun to provide assistance to persons other than those affected by cerebral palsy.

I don't know if you are renting or if you own your home, but if you are renting apply for Section 8 assistance to receive help paying your rent. Check to see if you are eligible for energy assistance in your home. There are programs which can help pay your heating/cooling bills.

As for health insurance, are you eligible for Medicaid in your state? If you even think you are, apply for it today.

Keep trying. Your VR counselors sound like lazy wankers. Keep asking and trying until someone tells you, "Yes!" and provides what you need to return to work.

All the best to you, Skippy.

[cementhead]

skip,if you have used up all your personal resources apply for medicaid and public aid.It's supposed to be there for people who need it.If you have not used up your assets liquidate them and put them in your sock drawer wait a couple months and apply for medicaid they will get you a wheel chair.also get an attorney and sue your long term disability provider it will take a while but pay off in the long run.
Good luck
Tom

[skippy13]

I have already dumped all of my resources to pay for living expenses for the almost 2 years I have been off of work. I thought I would be going back. But I do have to move into a chair, now and there is no place in a cleanroom for a wheelchair so going back to the same work is out of the question.
Funny thing I get too much money on SSDI (around 1070 per mo) to qualify for our state medicaid. HA! HA!
Yes, the voc rehab workers are lazy wankers. And to get services and get a chair through them, they have to take the application first. I cant make them do that.

[skippy13]

Thanks La Mem, I e mailed Easter Seals, I really hope they can help me.

[mingo]

The last time I worked in Voc Rehab, they at least had to accept your application as an 02 status. Even if you had made too much money previously (one year I think) they could at least offer testing for approiate work.

That's practially no help. I'd go to the regional level or see if there is an advocate at the state level.

[ancientgimp]

la mem and mingo are correct. Federal regs require they let you apply and that they place you in 02 status. Sounds like you ran into a dysfunctional local office. Go above their heads to regional or state level. You will be doing everyone a favor by making the system work right. You have every right to these services. I am a retired VR counselor.

[trainman]

Unfortunately, VR has always been more of an irritant than an asset for me. As has been said, they do have to help with things like a wheelchair for you to find work.

You basically have to find out what they are supposed to be doing for you and make them do it.

[november]

la mem and mingo are correct. Federal regs require they let you apply and that they place you in 02 status. Sounds like you ran into a dysfunctional local office. Go above their heads to regional or state level. You will be doing everyone a favor by making the system work right. You have every right to these services. I am a retired VR counselor.
Hey check your PMs. I sent you one a few days ago!

[Art454]

I would commit a small crime and get there attention.....what u have to loose at this point.

Art....am j/k maybe....after awhile u feel like the only attention you will get in front of the Judge.... when he asked you why u did it

[LaMemChose]

Thanks La Mem, I e mailed Easter Seals, I really hope they can help me.

You're welcome. Not to beat it to death, but I'd contact more than just Easter Seals. I'd call UCP simultaneously. That way if ES denies, you are still in the pipe at UCP.

Also, in checking to see what is available in my city for someone who needs a chair and doesn't have insurance for one, Good Will has started a medical equipment service here. The majority of it is gently used, but is available to area residents who are medically in need of it and are uninsured or under-insured. You might check to see if your city has something of the sort through Good Will or another agency. United Way would be a good place to phone to see who's doing what.

Good luck, Skippy.

[skippy13]

Thank You again LaMem... I will contact UCP. I talked to the people at the St Vincent De Paul, and even went to the store that had a chair. But it was an old 3 foot wide bariatric type chair. I am 5'4" and 120 lbs. I could not use that chair. I couldn't even push such a chair. I'm afraid that is all they have secondhand. It made me cry after I got done laughing. I just want to be able to get out of the house once in a while. Do things like I used to. I haven't been anywhere but the doctors and the grocery store for the past almost two years. I can't keep living like this. I have worked all of my life since I was 11 years old starting in the berry and bean fields. I dont know how to use or even know what services are available. I want to get out and get a job and be around people again.

Thanks again all for your suggestions:)
Amy

[skippy13]

I didnt hear from nobody. I give up. I emailed everyone, and I mean everyone. I dont have a phone anymore so I cant even call anyone. I had twenty dollars to buy groceries last month, I give up. I cant take this.

[LaMemChose]

Don't give up, okay? I find I get better results through phone calls and direct contact than through emails. What about using a neighbor's phone? A friend's? Family member's? Pay phone? If you live in an apartment, go to the office at the complex, explain what's up and ask to use the phone. You might ask the manager if she/he would be willing to be a contact for you.

First things first. Food. Check your community's food bank. Look up the info online and find their location. You may need to use public transit to get there and it will not be easy, but get thee on a bus and go for food or ask a friend or neighbor to help get you there.

Have you signed up for paratransit services? The service is usually door to door for any disabled person needing assistance with transportation. Reservations are required, but sign up as a consumer today if you have not already.

Get to your city's human services department and apply for food stamps or anything else for which you may qualify. Take medical bills you've paid out of pocket as this may make you eligible for more than it appears. If you've paid tens of thousands out of pocket for the surgeries and rehab, take proof of this with you to human services. If they want to keep any of your paperwork, ask them to make copies while you are there and keep the originals yourself.

I just read something in your profile. You were in the military for a few years. That means you have health insurance coverage through the VA. If you are not already working with them, get in touch immediately for an establishing appointment. Yes, you will need to call somehow and that means using someone else's phone, but do what ya' gotta. You need health insurance coverage. You have it. You just need to get established with the VA.

Also, for education ... Have you completed a FAFSA application in addition to trying to work with VR? FAFSA will tell you about student grants and low interest loans for which you may be eligible. You can get the info/application online. VR usually wants you to have completed a FAFSA ap anyway.

If you return to school and live on campus, you may have better access to food, transportation, assistance when you need it. You can also retrain, which you've said is a goal.

Don't give up. Hang in, Amy, and keep talking to us, okay?

[skippy13]

The VA is only interested in helping service connected. Not me. I have two degrees from a University and they do me no good when I cant get out of my house. As for family?? I havent seen any of my seven brothers and sisters in two years because I cant travel to see them. I have invited them to my house, but they have never and I mean never come to my house. Never. I'm tired of this. My condition is degenerative and getting worse . Every day there is something else gone or hurting. I'm sick of this.

[LaMemChose]

Not to be argumentative, but I have family members whose health issues are not service related and they receive medical care through the VA. None of their injuries or illnesses are service related.

I'm sorry you are having such a hard time, Amy. I wish I could change it for you, but I can't.

The VA is only interested in helping service connected. Not me. I have two degrees from a University and they do me no good when I cant get out of my house. As for family?? I havent seen any of my seven brothers and sisters in two years because I cant travel to see them. I have invited them to my house, but they have never and I mean never come to my house. Never. I'm tired of this. My condition is degenerative and getting worse . Every day there is something else gone or hurting. I'm sick of this.

[SCI-Nurse]

The VA is only interested in helping service connected.

This is absolutely NOT correct. I work for the VA and less than half the clients we work with are service connected. If you have a SCI and had an honorable discharge from the US military, you are eligible as a Category 4 veteran, which means the VA is mandated to provide your care. This includes inpatient and outpatient care (with no copayment unless you have a high income), medications, supplies, DME (wheelchairs, cushions, commodes, etc. etc.), etc. etc. If you served during wartime (ie, Vietnam era), are low income and disabled you may even be eligible for a small VA pension.

Have you applied for VA healthcare? Are you a member of PVA? If not, join (it is free) and your PVA NSO can then help you get into the VA system and get your care, equipment, etc. Here is a link to how to reach your closest NSO:

http://www.pva.org/site/PageServer?pagename=benefits_nsos

You can also download the easy to complete VA health benefits application here, and either e-mail it or hand carry it to your local VA medical center Member Services office:

https://www.1010ez.med.va.gov/sec/vha/1010ez/

Your profile does not indicate where you live, but every VA hospital is required to have a social worker who is the SCI care coordinator. Call the social work office of your local VA and ask to speak to this person. They must coordinate your care, get you to a VA SCI Center if your condition indicates the need (at least for a good annual check-up) and assure that you are getting what you need (including DME) as a SCI veteran.

I would be glad to answer any more questions you have about eligibility for VA health care or the VA SCI System of Care.

(KLD)

[skippy13]

I am eligible and enrolled in VA healthcare in group 5. Which means that I am an impoverished beggar. I get my neurontin, cymbalta and vitamins through them.

I am a Vietnam era vet, but my SSDI makes me ineligible for pension. It is more than the amount paid on SSI.

I am not a member of PVA, but I have been to the website many times.

I have not met the local SCI care coordinator, even though I have been going to the VA since October of last year. They are fully aware of my condition.

I'm also extremely discouraged and now very very deeply depressed. I'm not the sort to ask for anything twice. It is humiliating enough to have to ask for anything even once.

[Sugarcube]

Skippy13,

Do you need a manual or an electric chair? If you need a manual, I have one that you can have. It is a quickie 2 and needs some cleaning, but it is still useful. Can that help you some, at least temporarily?

ETA: This is really old model Quickie. I have used it mainly as a spare. The seat measurement is 16x18. It does not have a cushion...I'm using that right now. If you need any other info....let me know.:)

[LaMemChose]

I understand you are depressed and frustrated. That happens to all of us from time to time, especially when it feels as though we're against a wall. Still, if anything is to change in your life you will need to take the initiative to see that it happens. It is up to you.

If you are unwilling to ask for appointments more than once, you may find yourself stuck when you do not have to be. You'll need to decide if it is more important to have what you need and have a better semblance of control over your life or remain stubborn in whatever is driving you to refuse to push for help. You have more control over your life than you believe.

You may not have control over parts of your body, but you can control your actions.

Given the level of depression you are describing, I strongly urge you to go for counseling immediately. Contact the VA first thing tomorrow and get set up for a therapist. I know it is hard to take initiative when you are depressed, but I can guarantee your life situation will worsen astronomically if you do nothing.

Nothing changes if nothing changes.

As for the VA, just because they are "aware" of you and your situation doesn't mean anything. You have to request services and tell them what it is you need. When you need a medical appointment, you must request it.

Get pro-active, Amy. Tell them you want an appointment with the SCI coordinator. Ask for a case manger. Take the first appointment you can get. Ask for it more than once if you must, but do it.

I'm glad you are getting your meds covered. That's a huge help right there. That also sounds as though you are at least seeing a medical doctor (neurologist?) through the VA so you are established to an extent.

I'm unaware of what the different levels mean as far as VA healthcare, but KLD knows and is a gem. Hit her up with any questions you may have. She's a wealth of info and resources. Use that info and advice from her and act on it.

Going to the PVA site is not the same as joining. Sign on and learn what's available. You may be eligible for more than you think.

As far as phone service, if you have been approved and are receiving SSDI, you may be eligible for a greatly reduced rate for very basic home phone service. It would be a landline, but it would provide a means for you to call and make appointments and better coordinate what you need.

Services can be very pieced together and what's available is far from perfect, but there may be more you can do to help yourself. No one will do it for you, Amy.

Choosing to do nothing to change your situation is still a choice even if it seems it's not. It would be more humimilating for me to do nothing to help myself than to ask for help. The least humiliating choice of all is to take the best care of you that yuo can.

I understand you have gone from the body you were born and having a great career to being disabled and unemployed. That has happened to many of us and it's beyond frustrating and a host of other emotions. You cannot change your body, but you can change your actions.

Hang in and keep talking to us, eh? Just do what is necessary to take charge of your life.

I am eligible and enrolled in VA healthcare in group 5. Which means that I am an impoverished beggar. I get my neurontin, cymbalta and vitamins through them.

I am a Vietnam era vet, but my SSDI makes me ineligible for pension. It is more than the amount paid on SSI.

I am not a member of PVA, but I have been to the website many times.

I have not met the local SCI care coordinator, even though I have been going to the VA since October of last year. They are fully aware of my condition.

I'm also extremely discouraged and now very very deeply depressed. I'm not the sort to ask for anything twice. It is humiliating enough to have to ask for anything even once.

[SCI-Nurse]

I don't know anything about your specific injury, but if you have a spinal cord injury you are not correctly rated by the VA. A catastrophic disability like a SCI makes you category 4 eligible. A PVA NSO can get this straightened out for you. Of course if your SCI is very minor you may not qualify, but then you would not need a wheelchair.

Even as a category 5 you have full benefits for DME, including wheelchairs, commodes, grab bars, ramps, etc. etc. etc. You are also eligible to get your care through the VA, both locally and at your designated regional SCI center.

Out of pocket medical expenses can be used to adjust your income to determine your eligibility for needs-based programs in the VA. Again, the PVA NSO would be the best resource for you in how to file for this.

You need to be your own advocate to get to the local SCI coordinator. At most VAs no one is going to baby you through this. YOU must ask directly. If you don't get assistance, that is also something your PVA NSO should take care of for you.

If you know about the resources that you can get in the VA and choose not to use them, that is certainly up to you, but don't talk about what the VA won't do for you without asking the right questions and advocating for yourself using the resources that are there for you.

(KLD)

[skippy13]

It is true, you dont know anything about my specific injury, so let me enlighten you KLD. The first came in the 50's when as a small child I was run over (and I mean run over) by a car. It ran over the small of my back and broke my pelvis. The second came in the 60's when I slipped and fell on a wet floor fracturing L-5. The third came in the 60's also when I fractured C-5 on the balance beam. Luckily, no major damage at the time. Then in the 80's I got rear ended in a car at Disneyland. Didn't realize I was hurt at the time because I was in shock. That is when my hands went numb. In the 90's I broke T-3 with just a sneeze. Probably caused by the cancer treatment I was undergoing at the time. Add in a few more accidents and injuries over an active lifetime, mix in a whopping dose of arthritis and osteoporosis and what bakes up is a spinal column that is aged far beyond its chronological years.

I have severe multi level spinal stenosis and because of a relatively minor fall in 2006, central cervical cord syndrome. To use the albeit crude but accurate slang term, I am a barely walking quad because of a minor fall in 2006 that changed everything. 8 pages of a 24 page report from an orthopedic surgeon detail each of the affected vertebrae from C-4 to L-5. Even though I only injured a few vertebra, the rest have degenerative disc disease and arthritic changes including overgrowth of bone and bone spurs pressing into the nerve roots and other material pressing the spinal cord itself. The ortho report said my spinal cord on MRI looks like a string of pearls from C4 to T-2 and requires extensive surgery to correct. And there is joint instability throughout the rest of the body too. And the damage continues to accumulate because the arthritis is not stopped. Hardly a minor injury. I suffered greatly for many, many years trying to treat this conservatively, yet I strive to remain compassionate enough to remember that no injury is minor to those that suffer from it.

Another thing I try to remember is that no one knows everything they should know when they are new to a situation. I am not new to the injuries, but I am new to my acceptance of them and the treatment i should expect for them. I still panic at times, thinking I can somehow regain some semblance of my former life by just ignoring the truth. After all, I worked through the pain and growing deficit for many, many years. The above posts reflect just that. Denial. But I was a person that trained trainers in my former life and I constantly stressed one thing to all of those that I trained. A person who is new to a situation or job often is not even aware of the questions that they should ask. And the trainer is usually so expert in their field that they forget to teach the little mundane details of the job. They forget that they have to introduce each new person to one concept at a time. I admit that I know nothing about the treatment I should expect. I admit that I know nothing about how the VA handles new patients. How could I? I don't yet know the questions to even ask. I have no SCI instructor.

I thank you KLD for educating me about the VA, and I will ask the proper questions of them just as soon as I figure out what they are. I was not aware that I had to advocate for myself as I was under the impression that they were on my side. I'm sure that as soon as they can get all of my records from my previous doctors they will have a better idea of how to categorize me.
Amy

[skippy13]

I most sincerely thank you sugarcube for your very kind offer. But, I will first go to the VA and apply my pointy toed cowboy boots to the parts it might do the most good.

And LaMem and others, thank you for the education. I am learning the questions to ask and what services are available thanks to you.

Amy

[Sugarcube]

Okay skippy13. I hope that things start getting better for you soon. Take care and good luck with the Va. It sounds like you may have a lot of options there.