Methadone side effecs

[Melis11577]

Whereas I typically would agree with this Todd....You obviously didn't see the 20/20 report regarding Methadone...This is a MAJOR concern and it needs to be brought to attention. Quite a number of people have DIED due to inadvertant Methadone overdose or adverse reactions to Methadone. I appreciate Mike posting about it b/c I hadn't seen the entire report, but my mom did...My mom was prescribed Methadone and she had a bad reaction to it, she had to go back to the dr a week later to get a diff medication. After seeing that report, we learned that my mom may not have been properly educated on HOW to begin taking the Methadone(she may have been told & not remembered however)...

It seems that Methadone is NOT as "harmless" as it is promoted to be...Our eyes were really opened about it...

I am writing on behalf of HARMD (Helping America Reduce Methadone Deaths). We are the families of victims and those yet to be victims of methadone. www.HARMD.org (http://www.harmd.org/) I have come together with many other families throughout the United States who have lost loved ones to methadone.

We are asking government agencies to enact stricter guidelines in prescribing methadone for any reason. It must be mandatory that all doctors be certified and trained in the pharmacology of methadone; inpatient stays must be required during induction to methadone; all staff be extensively trained in monitoring methadone patients for symptoms of toxicity. Clinic patients should be tested for legal and illegal drugs that are taken with methadone to get “high” of experience “euphoria” such as benzodiazepines, alcohol, cocaine, heroin ect… and face severe consequences / mandatory detoxification from methadone program when presenting inebriated at clinic, clinic should also document such activity as well as prevent client from driving. Take home doses for all patients receiving methadone should be eliminated thus preventing the risk of diversion or precautions such as pill safe should be implemented. http://www.thepillsafe.com/ (http://www.thepillsafe.com/)

Current statistics show that nearly 4000 people a year die from methadone. These deaths are mostly happening to pain management and detoxification patients within the first 10 days of taking initial dose. Most of these deaths are related to methadone prescribed with other medications that react as additives with methadone. Diversion of methadone is a serious problem because it lands this most deadly drug on streets. Statistics also state that methadone is contributing to more deaths nationwide then heroine and cocaine.

The government did take notice after the 2003 record number of deaths associated with methadone and the Bush administration responded by gathering the top experts on drug overdoses, doctors, researchers, and medical examiners, as well as representatives from the federal Drug Enforcement Administration, Food and Drug Administration, and Substance Abuse and Mental Health Association. Finn and Tuckwiller (2006) report that “the man hired to research and write the report based on the conference, as well as background paper for conference participants, was Stewart B. Leavitt, and addiction specialist whose work is funded by the makers of methadone”. Stewart B. Leavitt PhD served as researcher/writer for A National Assessment of Methadone-Associated Mortality: Background Briefing Report from the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. Stewart B Leavitt also writes Addiction Treatment Forum Methadone Dosing & Safety in the Treatment of Opioid Addiction which is funded by Mallinckrodt, Inc. a manufacturer of methadone. My question is why hasn't a team of independent researchers not funded by pharmaceutical companies; a person or group of people that stand to gain no financial benefit on the outcome of the studies been hired to conduct the research? Finn and Tuckwiller (2006) report that “the man hired to research and write the report based on the conference, as well as background paper for conference participants, was Stewart B. Leavitt, and addiction specialist whose work is funded by the makers of methadone”. Stewart B. Leavitt PhD served as researcher/writer for A National Assessment of Methadone-Associated Mortality: Background Briefing Report from the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. Stewart B Leavitt also writes Addiction Treatment Forum Methadone Dosing & Safety in the Treatment of Opioid Addiction which is funded by Mallinckrodt, Inc. a manufacturer of methadone. On the forum associated with his website several of the clinic participants speak of diverting, misusing, stockpiling, selling, and potentiating methadone and other prescription drugs.

This methadone epidemic and deaths associated with it are not going away. It's only getting worse; I get contacted by families on a daily basis who have lost someone to this drug. At what point do we value human life over the convenience of others? Methadone patients, whether they are pain or clinic pose a risk to themselves and society as a whole if they are not monitored, dosed, and assessed correctly. Clinic patients getting into cars after being dosed who are using benzodiazepines, alcohol, or other opiates are killing innocent people on the road. This type of harm reduction is not saving lives it’s taking them. The government cannot continue to be a legal drug dealer in order for its citizens to “behave”. Many MMT patients claim that they have been able to maintain sobriety for long periods of time (several years) but are unhappy and depressed therefore seek out MMT and describe the "high" they get from this that makes they happy. Endorphin Deficiency is another "off-label" use of methadone. I have yet to be able to find this "diagnosis" listed in the DSM IV but I'm am sure they a large percentage of the population suffer from this as endorphin deficiency precipitated not only by opiate abuse but also eating disorders, ADHD, low levels of neurotransmitter GABA, PMS, stress, MS, depression etc....
I know the rules are in place for the clinics but they are NOT being followed. Patients sell take homes outside the clinics. In one news article a man died in the parking lot of a clinic after taking his brothers take home. This drug is too dangerous to be allowed in medicine cabinets! There is A LOT of money to be made from methadone but what expense is that money being made at? When do the risks outweigh the benefits of this drug? How many more people must die before changes are made that actually save lives?
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/472711451 (http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/472711451)
http://www.actionstudio.org/public/page_view_all.cfm?option=begin&pageid=7555&tmode=0 (http://www.actionstudio.org/public/page_view_all.cfm?option=begin&pageid=7555&tmode=0)

Sincerely

Melissa Zuppardi

[SCI-Nurse]

Moved from the Care forum.

(KLD)

[metronycguy]

this organization really should separate the drug maintenance and detox deaths from the pain management deaths.
one reason methadone is prescribed is the insurance companies want methadone since it is much cheaper than Oxycontin.

[LaMemChose]

Lou Dobbs of CNN has a series running each night this week during his program re: addiction to opiates/benzos and related problems.

As he reported last night, 20,000 people die each year ODing from rx meds. Not sure how much was/is diverted in those stats and how much was/is through misuse/abuse of prescription for the person who ODs.

[rfbdorf]

this organization really should separate the drug maintenance and detox deaths from the pain management deaths. I agree absolutely. They want to eliminate take-home doses. That would mean that the medication would be completely impractical for pain control - no-one is going to the clinic three times a day for their dose for pain relief. I agree that when it is prescribed for reasons related to drug abuse, then very tight control should be maintained on its usage, as irresponsible drug use has already been documented in those cases.
one reason methadone is prescribed is the insurance companies want methadone since it is much cheaper than Oxycontin.My wife used oxycontin, then fentanyl for quite a while; we have found methadone (aside from being MUCH cheaper) to be more effective for pain relief, and to have significantly fewer side effects for her, than either. It's probably different for everyone.
- Richard

[metronycguy]

a pain doc informed me that methadone since it is cheaper, is the default med by by some insurance companies. Here we have insurance companies dictating that patient should be exposed to a complicated med that can be deadly when mixed with other meds. This causes a double whammy, the drugstores don't like to mess with the lower profit margin schedule II narcotics, since the paperwork is the same for the ones where they make the big profit.
i agree this org wants methadone to be dispensed at clinics only. There is a big difference between addicts looking to get high and pain patients. addict are always going to try and get high, by selling or swapping.
i agree methadone patients need to be schooled in the dangers, its half life is so long that it is easy to over dose by taking other meds two weeks later.
i had the feeling that the organization was a shill for the safety pill dispenser too.

[Vickie Neal]

My quadriplegic brother was put on Methadone to help him off oxycontin for pain relief for lower back surgeries. This drug, the "BIG M", I call it, has dominated and ruled my brother's life, both pre and post SCI.

Right, a drug user already, he ABUSED the prescribed drug, often not taking it as prescribed and "holding off" in order to take several pills at once for a prescribed "high". These highs would leave him drooling, sitting naked on a commode where he'd went to have a bowel movement with his head between his knees for hours. When he came down off the high, he'd be mean as Hell and nobody would want to be around him.

He enjoyed the benefits of his methadone one year post SCI until he got his neuro doctor to put morphine in his baclofen pump. Unbeknownst to him, his methadone would have to be DC'd beause too many narcotics would be flowing through his body and become a threat to his health. When the meth was stopped, he was VERY angry, beligerant, hard to get along with, mean.....to name a few. He now strives on a daily basis to "get his meth back", even to the point of telling his neuro doctor to stop the morphine so he can have it back. It rules him, not he it and it makes me almost sick to watch him struggle to get it back for himself. He will do anything, say anything, tell any kind of lie, ANYTHING to get meth back. He even accuses ME, his sister and one who has stood by him through his SCI and took care of him, of being the cause that his meth was taken from him (a prized possession). The addiction makes me sick and I would recommend that people never get on it if they can help it.

Drug users and abusers will misuse it, definitely, you can bet on it. It is a menace and addictive and produces a hellacious effect on it user, who will swap, trade and sell it for other drugs. I can promise you that.

As you can tell, I'm totally against meth, because I have watched it destroy my brother, along with his other drug usages. Now he's in a body that won't move, which compounds everything else, but allows me to see him as he truly is, which is not a pretty sight.

Just input on my part on the methadone issue. Guess you can tell I hate the drug. Sorry I'm so blunt, but it hurts.

Sis to Quad on Meth

[David Berg]

Wow, you do have a difficult situtation. Just a short comment or two. First of all, opiates are notoriously ineffective at helping neuropathic pain. That said, methodone does appear to act on different receptors and sometimes does have more of a beneficial effect than other narcotics. Still, with your situation you have a real challenge. I believe you need one doctor in charge of all the pain meds and odds are very good that a GP is not experienced enough in SCI pain to be up to the challenge.

A seperate note. Methadone carries hazards that the prescribing doctor needs to be very familiar with before managing a patient using this as a long-term strategy. It remains in the body longer than it is effective for pain, so overdosing is a big concern. I understand it can be managed, but I sure wouldn't try using it (if you stick with this med at all) unless you have a doc who's very skilled.

I read your other post; how much Neurontin is he using? It often takes a larger dose to be effective for pain than when it's used for other conditions. Also, a number of people report that the name-brand version is much more effective. It's common for this to be combined with an anti-depressant such as Elavil. With neuropathic pain anti-depressants are directly effective for pain in addition to helping with depression that often accompanies chronic pain.

[quadvet]

Vickie, I'm sorry for your situation and hope you can get some help soon. Maybe the pain specialist option mentioned previously?

... opiates are notoriously ineffective at helping neuropathic pain. Why are they pushed on us as if they are, then?
With neuropathic pain anti-depressants are directly effective for pain in addition to helping with depression that often accompanies chronic pain. Lots of docs say that, but I'd like to see a true show of hands of those who have benefited from this off-label use of these drugs. I've tried several with only ill results; debilitating migraines, "zinging", "bad acid trips", etc. etc. that lasted for weeks and months at a time, and suicide.

[LaMemChose]

Sorry about your brother, Vickie, but the problem isn't Methadone. The problem is your brother. Take away Methadone and insert any other available opiate/benzo,whatever gets his ya-ya's off here.

Addiction is not about the drug, but is about the addict. For the addict it's about the drug, getting ands using and finding ways and means to get more, but ultimately it's never about a specific drug.

As for the original poster, yes, people at clinics often use other substances and drive away high. However, the problem isn't the Methadone. The problem is driving while high, while under the influence.

Again, blaming addiction on the Methadoine is like blaming a house fire on matches. Used appropriately the matches can be good, can start barbecue grills and fires in fireplaces and woodstoves and camp fires. When used to intentionally or unintentionally start a house fire, the matches become part of a bad situation. The matches aren't to blame. The person using the matrches carries the burden of responsibility, for action and consequence.

Remove the emotion from Methadone (and other legal substances) and the arguments change. Too many use deaths and ODs as hype against Methadone, IMO. Yes, the deaths are terrible, but the responsibility is with the person using the Methadone, not with the Methadone itself.

[justadildo]

methadone is synthetic heroin, plain and simple...it addicts and kills too many, just as heroin does

[metronycguy]

methadone has a value in society , it can work very well on pain. it is also very cheap compared to Oxycontin and fentanyl patches.
if your an addict , it doesnt matter if it is methadone, oxycodone Oxycontin ,vicodin, Valium etc, you will abuse it.
i don't think heroin has good pain relief qualities, but i am not sure?
if it did have good pain relief qualities i would be for using it. opiates seem to be very easy on the body compare to a lot of other drugs that attack the liver.
i am surprised at the longevity of some of the old junkies i see.

[metronycguy]

=
Why are they pushed on us as if they are, then?
they do work, the old notion of opiates not working is BS . i think that also causes people to stay in pain since doctors are not prescribing opiates when they should.


Lots of docs say that, but I'd like to see a true show of hands of those who have benefited from this off-label use of these drugs.
sorry to hear of your bad experiences. i had very good pain relief from neurontin. i had to stop using it due to side effects, but the pain relief was very good. i found tricyclic antidepressant such as amitriptyline works pretty well in neuro pain, 10 or 20 Mg's in the early evening. Lyrica does work on some of my neuro pain but not the pain i am having right now.

[quadvet]

they do work, the old notion of opiates not working is BS . i think that also causes people to stay in pain since doctors are not prescribing opiates when they should. For sure, they work great for pain, and I agree that docs should be more liberal with them when necessary. All options should be available to All persons.

However, if a person has real medical needs (i.e. colostomy or other pain relieving surgery, etc.), drugs shouldn't be used - forced on them - to mask pain.

FWIW, my personal experience with opiates and other pain meds for extended periods have been negative.


sorry to hear of your bad experiences. i had very good pain relief from neurontin. i had to stop using it due to side effects, but the pain relief was very good. i found tricyclic antidepressant such as amitriptyline works pretty well in neuro pain, 10 or 20 Mg's in the early evening. Lyrica does work on some of my neuro pain but not the pain i am having right now. 0.05 mg any kind of tricyclic wigs me out for days, and I tried all kinds of other different antidepressants with same results.

I have managed to work my way up to 3600 mg gabapentin a day over the years but really noticed no difference in my neuro pain. I really only took it - like everything else I tried - because they had me labeled as "uncooperative" with a "medication phobia". I don't notice any side effects, but my body doesn't like it if I try to stop it now.

.

[Raven]

methadone is synthetic heroin, plain and simple...it addicts and kills too many, just as heroin does

True. In the beginning, (why do I feel like I am quoting something), the use of Methadone was for the purpose of getting heroin addicts off heroin. I worked in a Methadone clinic myself. It was under federal and state supervision. There was one other doctor in town who was allowed to prescribe it to other addicts. His program was well known for the addicts being able to get into the program easily. They charged the patient for the prescription which was dispensed at the same clinic. In our clinic, we had to do a financial evaluation for each patient. If they did not bring in proof of their finances, they would not get to see the doctor. We also worked with a detoxification center which would house the patient during the detox period. They had to give urine samples and blood samples before they could be admitted to our program. During the time of their care they would be carefully monitored by the center and by us too. We also had patients which were on what we called Maintenance. They would be put on that status after several attempts at detoxication. The take home status was not something that was easily earned either. We had certain rules that had to be followed before they could be on the take home list and these patients were monitored even more than before. Our program was very strict with these patients.

Some of things I learned there was the fact that Methadone could/would become addicting and harder to get detoxified from. Something else that we found was that it was harder for them to detox from Methadone. Another thing is that many people don't realize is that addiction is not only physical but also mental. The human mind can be led to believe or tricked into believing that they cannot be without the drug of addiction. I recall our Psychiatrist telling our patients that it was all in their minds. They hated to hear that. They could not comprehend how our brain can work at times. We had patients who were taking placebo and they believed that they were taking Methadone. When approached and the suggestion of detox was brought up, they would say no. Later on they would ask our staff if their dose had been lowered. They didn't know that they were on placebo! and they would start saying that they were feeling as if withdrawing from the medication. They had to be assured that they were not being detoxed.

I have personally known people who have had to fight to get off it. They have had a hard battle to win. They have lost so much not only when they used it but the consequenses affecting their families. These people have told me how and what the ramifications of the use of it have left in their bodies too.

I am surprised that it is now used/prescribed as it is now. I think that the doctors now really should care more of what they prescribe to everyone and the effects left on their lives. I would think that doctors and those who originally started all this should do further studies before even keeping it in use for anyone at all. It can be a very dangerous drug if used with no control over it and those who prescribe or dispense it.

Raven

[quadvet]

In the beginning... ... Hitler used it to control people.

My body had a particular aversion to methadone after several years and forced me to detox on my own, here at home. It was a month forgotten other than nightmares and hallucinations.

[Vickie Neal]

I want to thank you guys for input to my post. I wrote a lengthy message and somehow it was lost and I have to log in again and now I don't know if I can remember all I'd previously written or not, but here goes:

David Berg - MOderator -- My brother takes 1800 mg. Neurontin/day, 25 mg. Doxipan at bedtime, 200 mg. Seroquel/day, 60 mg. Cymbalta/day, 5 mg. METHADONE at bedtime only, 700 mg. Soma/day - along with all his other vitamins, protinix, and bowel program meds. He also take Bumex, but won't take potassium because he says it burns his stomach.

LeMem Chose - I agree with you totally that the problem is not the Methadone itself, but the user, my brother. I knew that when I made my post, but was just bewildered and lashed out at the drug. Thanks for drawing it to my attention, but I agree with you. The drug just took over my brother's life (with his approval of course), and now it rules him, not he it.

Raven - My brother got his first Methadone as "pain management" from local clinic. Workers Comp footed the bill for it, and he wasn't monitored much except for a little visit monthly with doc to get new prescription. Then it was every TWO months.

Quadvet - You seem to relate to my brother because you seem to have had the same problems with this stuff as he. I appreciated the fact that you detoxed yourself off this methadone. You must be a strong willed person. I only wish my brother were strong enough to do that. He isn't or doesn't WANT to be. He, too, has been labeled as "uncooperative and medication phobic". Thanks for your insight and attention to my problem here. Your suggestion for ONE doctor for all meds was mentioned by monitor too. I'm going to go that route if I can.

Thanks again everyone
Vickie

[LaMemChose]

My brother takes 1800 mg. Neurontin/day, 25 mg. Doxipan at bedtime, 200 mg. Seroquel/day, 60 mg. Cymbalta/day, 5 mg. METHADONE at bedtime only, 700 mg. Soma/day - along with all his other vitamins, protinix, and bowel program meds. He also take Bumex, but won't take potassium because he says it burns his stomach

Vickie, one of the things I notice about the meds he takes is that he takes Seroquel. Isn't that a med for bipolar? If he's manic/depressive that may fuel his addictions, make it more difficult for him. When I was in treatment, many people were identified as having underlying psychiatric issues and were placed in a seperate detox/rehab program.

Quadvet - You seem to relate to my brother because you seem to have had the same problems with this stuff as he. I appreciated the fact that you detoxed yourself off this methadone. You must be a strong willed person. I only wish my brother were strong enough to do that. He isn't or doesn't WANT to be. He, too, has been labeled as "uncooperative and medication phobic". Thanks for your insight and attention to my problem here. Your suggestion for ONE doctor for all meds was mentioned by monitor too. I'm going to go that route if I can.

If your brother is an addict he may need professional help to get off the drugs. It'll happen when, and if, he's ready, but not before. I learned from my own experience that nothing helped until I admitted I had a problem with rx benzos, rx opiates and vodka, but not before.

Using one doctor for his meds is a great idea. Also, using a single pharmacy is good as it's easier to see what meds are being taken and in what quantities. A good pharmacist will look for possible med interactions. Of course, that doesn't address any other drugs you've indicated he does which aren't prescribed for him.

I wish him the best.

[Raven]

Vickie, I can understand your view on the subject. In my family we have had to deal with drug addiction. My niece got on the Methadone program and she is the one who told me what is was like to attempt to get off of it. My late sis died of an over dose of barbituates. Much of what you said about your brother reminds me of the things they both did while addicted without getting help. But first I would like to address some of the things you have mentioned in your second post:

He also take Bumex, but won't take potassium because he says it burns his stomach.

Vickie, has your brother been prescribed potassium and if so, what is the reason? I have to take potassium pills but have not met with burning sensation. The only time I have dealt with that feeling is when it is given through an IV. The reason I have to take potassium is that my level does go down. At times it has been due to my having to take diuretics for swelling of my legs and feet. Does he have this problem too?

I agree with you totally that the problem is not the Methadone itself, but the user, my brother. I knew that when I made my post, but was just bewildered and lashed out at the drug. Thanks for drawing it to my attention, but I agree with you. The drug just took over my brother's life (with his approval of course), and now it rules him, not he it.

As I previously mentioned, we have had to deal with addiction in my family so I can emphatize and know what you speak of. The hardest thing for us to do is just to stand/sit by and watch them destroy their lives. Then when they have small children, it is harder becaue we realize and see the pain brought upon their children too. We feel helpless and many times angry at them or the drugs they abuse. It is very frustrating. My sis's grown children asked me for advice because they didn't know what to do with her. The only thing I could suggest at that time was involuntary detox. I didn't or couldn't think of anything else. No one did anything. She had car wrecks, got beat up by who know who, kept going downhill and we watched on helplessly and dying inside of us. It is painful to see that trip down. I know. I loved her but I didn't know what to do either. In the end, we lost her to the drugs. Luckily, my niece came to. She found a way to fight it all. She got into some religious belief which has helped her to see things in a different perspective thankfully. She is now very active in that church. Accepts her mistakes and is not on the road of self destruction. We keep hoping that she will continue in that manner. I hope and pray that your brother one day realizes his mistake too. My niece did it and hopefully he will also.
My brother got his first Methadone as "pain management" from local clinic. Workers Comp footed the bill for it, and he wasn't monitored much except for a little visit monthly with doc to get new prescription. Then it was every TWO months.

This is what I don't understand. It was originally started as a means to get the heroin addicts off of heroin. The plan was to help them detox to the degree of not having to be dependent on Methadone either. It was just for detoxification not for pain treatment. It was supposed to make it easier for them to deal with the withdrawal symptoms from the heroin. The thing is that this was around 27 - 29 years ago. We knew that addicts would also attempt to get other drs to prescribe other meds that were addicting or mood altering. We watched and monitored them for this same reason. Urine tests were ramdomly taken. They were taken in the presence of either the social worker, nurse or same gender staff member. If at any time their results came in "dirty" they would lose "take home" or if not on take home, then they would have to speak with the social worker and doctor in a conference. They would/could be put on forcible detox or put out of the program if necessary. Rules were strict and to be followed closely.

I guess drs now have less concern on the effects and repercusions brought on by drugs such as Methadone. It appears to me that it has become easy to just prescribe any drug to keep the patient out of the office and out of the way. So many of these drugs used nowadays are addicting, either physically and/or mentally and none of them seem to care to help the patient deal with the pain in a manner that is not detrimental to them. Of course pain is hard to deal with. But there must be something that will not have such an effect on lives to this point of becoming in a manner of speaking a way of also killing them and destroying their lives.


Quadvet - You seem to relate to my brother because you seem to have had the same problems with this stuff as he. I appreciated the fact that you detoxed yourself off this methadone. You must be a strong willed person. I only wish my brother were strong enough to do that. He isn't or doesn't WANT to be. He, too, has been labeled as "uncooperative and medication phobic". Thanks for your insight and attention to my problem here. Your suggestion for ONE doctor for all meds was mentioned by monitor too. I'm going to go that route if I can.

I too agree with Vicky Quadvet. I admire your strength and desire not to let it rule your life. Your suggestion is really good. It is a way of keeping better tabs on the patient and avoiding not only contraindications of meds but also to possibly avoid dependence on the medications that can be addicting.

Vicky, if you may ever wish to vent or speak with me, just send me a PM. I will happy to be there for you. Have traveled the road you travel.

Raven

[quadvet]

Quadvet - You seem to relate to my brother because you seem to have had the same problems with this stuff as he. I appreciated the fact that you detoxed yourself off this methadone. You must be a strong willed person. I only wish my brother were strong enough to do that. He isn't or doesn't WANT to be. He, too, has been labeled as "uncooperative and medication phobic". Thanks for your insight and attention to my problem here. I didn't want to stop either, but was forced to. My body had a particular aversion to methadone after several years and forced me to detox on my own, here at home. It was a month forgotten other than nightmares and hallucinations. To elaborate, after ~8 years increasing doses, increasing pain and side effects simply made it impossible to take - the effects of taking it was worse than stopping. Total "survival" mode, both on it and while dc'ing. Not sure how to better explain, but wasn't a matter of will, just survival. I don't know how to convince someone they have a problem with it. Wish I could be of more help.

[metronycguy]

this is what I don't understand. It was originally started as a means to get the heroin addicts off of heroin. The plan was to help them detox to the degree of not having to be dependent on Methadone either. It was just for detoxification not for pain treatment.
methadone was originally developed and used as pain killer in Germany in wwII . it is a synthetic opioid and had and has a great use as a painkiller then and now. synthetic opioids tend to work better on neuropathic pain than opioids. ultram is also a synthetic , it works very well on lower level neuropathic pain , much less side effects compared to oxycodone.
the use of methadone for addicts was a secondary use, i have no idea why ?.
if a person has an addictive personality it doesn't matter what meds are prescribed, they will abuse them all.
the problem with a bonafide pain patient and a addictive personality , they cant do without due to the pain.
i also wonder what the comparison of methadone doses are for pain patients and addicts?

[justadildo]

metro has a valid point, with addictive genes you're screwed from the get go..

[Raven]

I found this source of information on Methadone is on the following link. It pretty much answers some of the questions brought up about the usage and reasons for prescribing it. I worked in the clinic and at the time, in the town I lived in, it was allowed for heroin addiction only. I honestly don't remember ever hearing of it being prescribed for other use. At that time I was already dis and had to deal with any pain of my own without any medication(s).

http://www.heroinaddiction.com/heroin_methadone.html


metro has a valid point, with addictive genes you're screwed from the get go..

I do however do agree with Metro about those who have the tendency to addiction whether it be physical or mental. I think it is pretty hard to understand how the mental addiction process works at times but it does happen, I saw it in our clinic. One thing I think also is a major factor on that is the tolerance level that is formed with the continuous use of any mood altering drug(s) or pain killer(s). I recall someone I personally knew who got addicted to aspirin. :dontknow:

Raven

[Vickie Neal]

I would like to say "thanks again" to you guys on this methadone issue. Just hearing different opinions and view points helps. You guys are great.

Raven: My brother (Peety) is prescribed potassium as supplement for diuretics like yourself. I've taken him to church in the old 82 Van I bought with a lift in it. He seems to do better for a few days after a church going. I truly believe it's very good for him, but most Sundays can't get him to budge - He's in too much "excruciating pain" to move (according to him, that is)

I feel like his mind is going these days (somewhere far away) and he tends to "lose it" and will not take half of his prescribed meds stating that he's in "excruciating pain" and needs his METHADONE back or he's going to die. He really believes this too. It's very real to him in his mind. He's NOT in excruciating pain or he wouldn't sleep for two hours without a twitch sitting up in his wheelchair. He won't go to bed because he says he can't sleep for the pain, so he sleeps in the chair.

He's refusing his potassium, along with his bladder spasm meds. and vitamins because he says they have acidic bases in them that irritates his stomach lining. He's nuts, I think, and I tell him so many days - and I KNOW I don't need to do that, but I do.

He just got the prescription for Seroquel, Cymbalta (again), and Doxipin (sp?) Tuesday of this week from a psychiatrist. He started refusing to take these "mind altering" drugs as soon as he got back with the prescription, but finally consented with MUCH pressure from my family. He's been doing much better since he started taking these meds. according to what those sitting with him are saying. He is speaking to me without a snarl in the last 2 days and seems calmer. Told his night sitter that this was some "good stuff". Ultimately, I guess that's what it's all about with him - the "good stuff" that makes him goo goo.

I've about come to the conclusion that if "Mikie's Happy", let it be. I'm tired of fighting with him. I'll do my fighting on my knees in days to come.

Thank you guys again for your comments. It's helped just to have some unbiased answers, keeps me in check.

Vickie

[Sincity]

Wow some interesting stuff here specially the one by quadvet intersting can i ask why you kept increasing, methadone i think once stable you should stay on that dose, I've been on 15mg for like 8yrs now , and i find it a bitch to come off, so i just stay on it, it worked so good in the first 5yrs but the last 1yr or so has been difficult in other ways, stress perhaps might not be methadone, but side effects bother me like constipation , weight gain being the sadest yet, yet i still take it because i feel without it ill be snappy irritable and relapse, what i try not to do is increase it and so far so good, maybe i have 1/2 dozen times in 8yrs , and dont mix anything else with it and it seem's to be alot better, that and eat ok exercise, I'm not sure how ive gotten so far with it and without increasing with an addictive personality , I also have anxiety/dep problems too the times i felt i want to increase are only if things are stressfull but then i get more side effects so its not worth it , its nice to chill out though now and again but apparently your not supposed to feel anything on methadone just normal I often wonder if i was to come of it , my normal might be different but yeah she's a bi$% to come off thats for sure ....thanks Sin

[quadvet]

quadvet intersting can i ask why you kept increasing, methadone i think once stable you should stay on that dose
I got no pain relief and my docs just kept saying to take more, that I hadn't reached a "therapeutic level" yet. The side effect of physiological pain of the constipation you mention exacerbated my already constant autonomic dysreflexia and skyrocketed my neuropathic pain. I find pain narcotics effective for short-term use only; too many side affects concluded with diminishing pain relief.

Welcome to the CareCure Community you Sinner, you are in good company. :D

ETA: Would you fill in your profile info please, it's nice to know who we are talking to. Tanks.

[Sue Pendleton]

As for the one doctor rule many states allow only pain management doctors to prescribe methadone for anything but addiction. I took it while inpatient at rehab for neuro pain after trying damn near everything else. I had horrid hallucinations on amitryptiline, tried to bite the clonidine patch off my arm it itched so bad but couldn't reach it and had to wait for rounds..., codiene, morphines, etc. put me right to sleep (we're talking kid doses), valium alone and later has been the only thing to help my spasms and I haven't titrated that up much in 11 or 12 years. So that 5 mg of methadone once a day just made me feel like the pain was still there but that was ok. Everything else made sense and I was awake so this was fine with me. Thankfully by the time I left rehab that first time my neuro pain was way down and my ability to twitch the effected, burning muscles was improving. I had no problems being taken off it in a few step downs.

Mass. General Hospital has been doing a clinical trial for neuro pain using methadone for a long time now. There does seem to be a tendency in non-addictive personalities to not become psychologically addicted to pain meds. They still need to do withdrawel if they go off them but it is for physical addiction.

[JonnyC]

I first used Methadone for addiction and when I stopped (cold turkey) it was bad for a while and the pain was bad, so I went back to it.
The thing with Meth is it blocks all unwanted thoughts but is worse than any other opiate to come off, esspecially liquid meth.
Good stuff but bad in some ways!

[amethyst]

I am very sorry for anyone who is addicted to anything, it must be horrible, both for the addict and for their families. I can only say that my experience with methadone has been very positive. I have been on it for about a year and a half. Recently I decreased my dosage with no ill effects. I prefer it to oxycontin which I had been on previously. I am more alert and less sleepy.

Remember that different people react to drugs differently.

[David Berg]

Methadone is an interesting alternative for a couple of reasons. One thing I remember hearing is it may help some who haven't had luck with other narcotics because it acts on different receptors. There are problems associated with it, as has been discussed, but it is an option to consider.

[mike bauer]

Why support something that make this medicine a true pain in the ass to get.. for those of us Spinal Cord Injuries that live in despirate Pain 24-7? Again, we are poing to regulate because abusers screw it up for the real reason the drug was intended. Just like everything else. Someone shoots someone with a gun... and they want the guns removed. Why not take all cars away... one guy gets drunk.. kills somebody.. Take the cars away. Take everything away because of the abusers. Keep those of us who live in desparate 24-7 pain from being able to get it. Yea, that makes sence... Your fools if you fall for this rubbish. Morons too!

[crppled007]

I just recently started taking methadone as nothing else, would work. Now, I haven't tried OxyContin. Just lots of hydrocodone, diluadid. I went to the new a doctor and methadone was the first thing he said I should try. And it does seem to work for the pain however, the only side effect I have is about two hours after I take it. My hands curl up and I get severe clonus shaking in my hands. Has anybody else ever heard of that or had that happen? I'm taking 10 mg three times a day.
Cripp

[mike bauer]

I want all cars taken from the road. And Motorcycles, because I crashed and became Paralized. I also want Beer and Cigs taken off the market. I want Comuters taken cause I heard somebody threw one at his brother and put his eye out! Get rid of everything. Get rid of everybody. Get rid of.........

[mike bauer]

I want all cars taken from the road. And Motorcycles, because I crashed and became Paralized. I also want Beer and Cigs taken off the market. I want Comuters taken cause I heard somebody threw one at his brother and put his eye out! Get rid of everything. Get rid of everybody. Get rid of.........

[Sabbathmusic]

Methadone is not JUST used in a pain scenario because it is cheap. What people must realize and I can say this until I am blue in the face; a person that lives in constant pain is going to need more and more of their medication. This is inevitable. Thus a person that has used up all their resources in their conventional opiate applications Methadone is the only alternative. Example a person that is prescribed 20 OxyContins in time is going to need more and more. This is inevitable. The more a person is active physically the more opiates they are going to require. Of course 70 year old grandma's can remain on a steady dose for years. This is not realistic in the world where a patient has to support their family.

Oxycodone is a difficult drug to remain on long term, all opiates are and the only successful way of using them is to take only as needed, not even as prescribed on the bottle. All opiates in general are extremely difficult to use effectively over long durations without some days of absence from the drug. People must acept they cannot live without pain 24 hours a day , seven days a week.

Methadone is a ideal resource when a advance pain managements person's medication resources are completely used up. Methadone maintains a constant and flat blood level throughout and it is void of a person having to use more and more just to keep a opiate mood blood level in check. This is advantageous to addicts and pain people both!

As far as Methadone being prescribed by only advanced doctors, I can explain to anyone in three minutes the proper way to administer this drug for pain, It is not rocket science at all and it is the easiest opiate to use for pain if used twice a day and the lowest possible working dose is adhered to for the longest possible duration. This is true with all opiates. And as far as it being cheap. There are millions of American's that live in chronic pain that cannot even get insurance and instead of HARMD bashing and telling lies about methadone they should be diverting their funds and brains into creating a plan so this nation can get a health plan that can pay for a person's 700 dollar a month OxyContin script if they think that Methadone is only used because it is cheap.

Suboxone cannot be used in a advanced stage pain scenario because it is only a partial MU -receptor agonist and there is no way it is as effective for pain as methadone is. And as far as calibrating Suboxone for pain, you cannot go by half-life in coordination with applying the doses.

Also a person that lives in chronic pain will suffer what is called opiate-induced hyperanalgesia. A A phenomenon where when the dose is going down the patient feels more pain. It is so easy for a person to say, "Methadone should not be used for pain" until they felt this. Methadone risks for this are the lowest and it is the only acceptable answer when a person's 80mg OxyContins are not working anymore.

Fentanyl that can be applied three times a day via a patch has extreme addiction potential over any other opiate and id 30.40 times more potent than heroin. SO throwing on a patch for three days is not the answer either. And people that are on Fentanyl patches for pain also at the end of the month suffer till their next doctor visit. Living in pain is hell and taking opiates to relief that pain is a tremendous sacrifice a person makes. We pay dearly.

Suboxone taper friendly? Of course it is and this varies on the individual and the degree of dependence. It is my theory that partial MU-agonists are more difficult to wean off of in a full-blown physically dependant person because it randomly fills receptors and does not always target the right one's. This creates chaos when in withdrawal and the symptoms jump back and fourth from depression to god knows what else. Methadone should not be prescribed to a person in pain management that only has in their prescription history they were given 5mg Vicodins and the truth of the matter is a person prescribed 5mg's of Hydrocodone would not even feel methadone working , and this is where overdosing problems arise.

We must as a people educate ourselves and be not so quick to blame everyone else and as far as putting your trust in a doctor? How can we without getting a little insight on them first. After all he live in a world where doctor's have amputated the wrong leg or left a soiled rag in a stomach after surgery. So how can we blame anyone.

Again the pharmacology of methadone as used in a pain scenario is not that difficult, if used with other opiates, extreme small doses of both and never mix with a benzodiazepiene or alcohol. Unfortunatley the last 40 years of research on Methadone was used in the application of addiction and not for pain. I was a Methadone guinea pig and I harbor no ill-resentments towards my doctor. I wrote this article once, the first was better and I cannot go back and spell check, I do not want to loose it and I am Sabbathmusic. I weaned off of 200mg's of methadone a day as prescribed for pain and had them in my hand, you can see mu video's on U-tube and I am on Yahoo questions and answers.

[djolicoeur]

I have been on methadone for 12-13 years. My dosage has only been increased three times during that period. I have never understood the conterversy around this medication. I have never had the feeling of beeing high. I thought it was synthetically altered so that it would not make you high? Anyhow methadone has been a life saver in several ways. Constipation is not a problem for me with this compared to opiates. I find it does alter memery and thought process but is one of the best pain medications I have used. I could not funtion at all on morphine, but can live a somewaht normal life since I have been on this. Everyone is different and medication reactions are not the same. It is a synthetic and comparing it to herion is asinine. I was told I would be on it the rest of my life. I do dread the withdrawles if I have to come off it, however lyrica was worse than morphine for me.

[HUGE JAKE]

I WENT TO MY PAIN DOCTOR AND HE TRYED TO PUT ME ON methadone IS THAT WORSE THAN OXYCONTIN I NEVER BEEN ADDICTED TO ANY DRUGG DO THAT MEANS NOW SINCE IM ON PERCOCETTS AND OXYCONTINS THAT IM GOING TO GET ADDICTED PLEASE LET ME KNOW IM A FAMILY MAN AND NEVER HAD PROBLEMS WITH DRUGS NOW MY FAMILY IS TELLING ME THAT MY DOCTORS ARE MAKING ME INTO A DRUG ADDICT BUT IM IN SEVERE CRAZY PAIN ALL DAY I DIDNT KNOW THAT SITES LIKE THIS EXSIST I NEED SOMEONE TO TELL ME THE 100% TRUTH

[AddictionWriter]

I have dealth with Methadone for years. It is promoted as "the" treatment for heroin adiction but treatment for heroin addiction would result in a drug free individual, not an addict who now pays different people for thier drugs. I am outraged at where we have let Methadone presciption get to in this country.

http://www.dallas-texas-drug-rehab.org/

:applaud:

[crppled007]

I WENT TO MY PAIN DOCTOR AND HE TRYED TO PUT ME ON methadone IS THAT WORSE THAN OXYCONTIN I NEVER BEEN ADDICTED TO ANY DRUGG DO THAT MEANS NOW SINCE IM ON PERCOCETTS AND OXYCONTINS THAT IM GOING TO GET ADDICTED PLEASE LET ME KNOW IM A FAMILY MAN AND NEVER HAD PROBLEMS WITH DRUGS NOW MY FAMILY IS TELLING ME THAT MY DOCTORS ARE MAKING ME INTO A DRUG ADDICT BUT IM IN SEVERE CRAZY PAIN ALL DAY I DIDNT KNOW THAT SITES LIKE THIS EXSIST I NEED SOMEONE TO TELL ME THE 100% TRUTH


Ok, first don't type in all caps. Oxy is higher on the scale than methadone. Chronic pain IS something you'll have to deal with the rest of your life. I'm in the same boat as you. My family was calling me an addict, I was just wanting the high, popping 8-10 pills a day. Have one of your family members go with you to the Dr. Going from many(I mean MANY) pills a day to a couple takes a lot out of the equation. Methadone does work, and is used for pain managent. My wife freaked when my Dr said methadone, when it's managed correctly. You don't take it like a regular pain pill because the half-life is a lot longer, 48-72hrs compared to 4-6hrs for others. Do research on the internet on 'managed methadone'.
Good luck
cripp