Rare Hamburger?

[monkeygirl]

OK, I've been wondering about this for a long time and it relates to you Yankee folk. Again tonight, I saw in a movie where a gal ordered a hamburger "RARE" Now this is definately a south of the border thing. I've noticed differences in our food but, I can't believe you guys really do eat hamburger rare, it's e-coli waiting to kill.

So question being do you guys really eat it rare, or is it just a weird movie thing? They always do wierd stuff about us Canadians that we don't do too! http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/confused.gif

[CLC379]

there are some idiots actually eating raw or very lightly cooked hamburger called tiger beef = perfect recipe for bowel explosion.

steaks can be cooked rare because the inside is sterile, almost every speck of hamburger has been exposed to air and should be cooked to well done.

[antiquity]

I just saw a discovery health program about E-Coli O157:H7. After that I couldn't look at raw meat without gagging.

Eating rare beef is disgusting and risky to me but a lot of Americans like the taste of warm cow blood, they call it extra juicy. http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/eek.gif

[Sue Pendleton]

I like my burgers WELL DONE! Refused to eat the things in the army because they weren't. Yet as a kid and later in Europe I liked steak tartare. Doubt I'd touch it now though. I think we have serious problems with food inspectors and expecting our food to be so cheap. It's probably a major cause of obesity.

[marmalady]

Sue, steak tartar is steak that has been chopped on site at the restaurant, usually 'a la minute', that is to order. It hasn't gone through the same mass grinding procedures that hamburger meat has. Although a steak isn't exactly 'sterile', as CLC said, it hasn't been exposed to all the processing that ground meat has.

For those of you (and I include myself in that category!) who do love your burgers rare, I'm starting to see 'irradiated' ground beef on the market; it's being sold to a lot of the big burger chains, and supposed to be bug-free. Or you can buy a piece of chuck roast/sirloin, and grind your own, either in a food processer, or with an attachment to a Kitchen Aid mixer. That way, you know exactly how clean the equipment and handler are, and you know exactly what meat has gone into it.

_____________
Tough times don't last - tough people do.

[monkeygirl]

No way Marmalady! Wow I all most tossed my cookies when I read that you eat raw hamburgler http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/eek.gif. The thought of that seriously made me ill. If you were to order that here I doubt that anyone would serve it, geez I even think it's the law with the Food and Drug administration. We're always seeing and hearing commercials on what temperature to make sure our hamburgler is at, so that is thorougly cooked and e-coli free. This new hamburgler your talking about irradiated, if it is possible, geez what would they have to do to it to make it bug free other than cooking it? Makes you wonder http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/eek.gif. Please don't tell me you guys eat your poultry rare too, I don't think my tummy could handle another thing right now. Oh, no offence marmalady, just gross's me right out.

PS. Makes me think though, I should buy stocks in your biggest "toilet paper" company, and the company that makes "immodium" http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

PS. Gaad! seneca "warm cows blood" that says it all right there! Oh no where's my bucket?

[Max]

Wise thinks its unlikely to happen in US...

But I Think its only matter of time

==============================
"Experience teaches that, of all the emotions, fear stands alone in its power to move us, or to capture us in its grip forever. In a world of terrors, there is nothing more fearsome that the unknown...especially when what is unknown is ourselves." Outer Limits(Fear Itself)

[marmalady]

LOL, Monkeygirl - I didn't say raw, I said rare - bordering on medium rare! And steak tartar is totally different from raw hamburger, for the reasons I stated below! If you serve steak tartar, or order it in a restaurant, be sure of your supplier, and only buy the best, and only order it from top quality restaurants. And no, I don't eat my chicken rare - although I did see 'chicken sushi' on the Iron Chef once!!

Look here for an article about irradiated beef:

http://www.fdi.org/fdimag/020715newbeef.html

Oh - How do you like your eggs? Over easy? Same problems!

C'mon, all you cowboys out there - help me out!!!!

_____________
Tough times don't last - tough people do.

[Shannon]

GO VEGGIE!!!

Okay, I just made a lot of friends, huh? I'll shut up.

[antiquity]

OMG, I love Iron Chef. I'm absolutely fascinated by it because it's soooo disgusting lol. And how the panel ooo's and ahh's when they hear something will be served raw and gasp when they hear it'll be cooked. (I understand that it's a cultural thang but still). http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif

I won't comment on how great veggie burgers are. http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/tongue.gif

Monkey, in all fairness, don't you guys eat big fat slabs of bacon up there? http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif

[bushman]

Originally posted by seneca:


Monkey, in all fairness, don't you guys eat big fat slabs of bacon up there? http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif

NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TD]

I like my burgers just a little pink in the middle. Cooked meat does not have to be leather-tough!! http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif If the meat is cooked but still pink then I will eat it 'til the cows come home!! http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

"And so it begins."

[monkeygirl]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by seneca:


Monkey, in all fairness, don't you guys eat big fat slabs of bacon up there?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I WISH!!! We make awesome bacon but we hardly ever eat it here, once or twice a year for me Especially in BC. We're the most healthiest of all Canadians, we're total health nuts here. They say it's cause we're on the coast, ocean, mountains and our climate, there's so much to do all year around. I think people would get looked at funny if they ordered bacon these days. Certainly nothing like rare hamburger though. (eeeww gaad)

[monkeygirl]

This is from your own USDA:

What can you do to prevent E. coli O157:H7 infection?

Cook all ground beef and hamburger thoroughly. Because ground beef can turn brown before disease-causing bacteria are killed, use a digital instant-read meat thermometer to ensure thorough cooking. Ground beef should be cooked until a thermometer inserted into several parts of the patty, including the thickest part, reads at least 160º F. Persons who cook ground beef without using a thermometer can decrease their risk of illness by not eating ground beef patties that are still pink in the middle.

If you are served an undercooked hamburger or other ground beef product in a restaurant, send it back for further cooking. You may want to ask for a new bun and a clean plate, too.

Avoid spreading harmful bacteria in your kitchen. Keep raw meat separate from ready-to-eat foods. Wash hands, counters, and utensils with hot soapy water after they touch raw meat. Never place cooked hamburgers or ground beef on the unwashed plate that held raw patties. Wash meat thermometers in between tests of patties that require further cooking.


Avoid swallowing lake or pool water while swimming. See more information about this.

Make sure that persons with diarrhea, especially children, wash their hands carefully with soap after bowel movements to reduce the risk of spreading infection, and that persons wash hands after changing soiled diapers. Anyone with a diarrheal illness should avoid swimming in public pools or lakes, sharing baths with others, and preparing food for others.

For more information about reducing your risk of foodborne illness, visit the US Department of Agriculture's Food Safety and Inspection Service website at: http://www.fsis.usda.gov or the Partnership for Food Safety Education at: For more advice on cooking ground beef, visit the U.S. Department of Agriculture web site at: http://www.fsis.usda.gov/OA/topics/gb.htm

I edited some of it but I left in the part about swimming in a pool for the next time you get the trots.
http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/eek.gif

[ghoti]

I'm on your side on this one, Marmalady. Beef cooked well done just gets tough and loses it's flavor, IMO. Sorry Monkeygirl, but if you have a weak stomach and like cooked meat, DON'T READ THE REST OF THIS POST! The reason meat turns from red to brown with cooking is because that's just the color of cooked blood. It's the cooked blood from meat juices that makes gravy brown too. Pure protein without blood in it is nearly transparent when raw and turns white when cooked. Don't believe me - look at egg white. Mostly made up of protein suspended in water. Sorry if that grosses anyone out, but I warned you!

[LauraD]

O.k. I guess I have to gross you out too! I like my steak and burgers medium rare. I used to like "cannibal burgers" (raw hamburger with a mixture of seasonings) but I have to admit the E Coli thing has scared me away from that.

[Erin81079]

I guess I will add that I eat medium rare Hamburgers too, depending on where they come from. I used to order rare hamburgers from a restaurant that I worked in , but they had the highest quality of meat available. American beef is raised in this Country where there is no Mad cow disease. But if it arrives and I'm meant to have it, then I guess I'll have to deal with it then. Haven't gotten sick from it yet, and have a healthy immune system. So I guess I'll take my chances. But I'm a risk taker, what can I say.

[Sue Pendleton]

Oh definitely Marm. Dad and I would go to this butcher and Dad would choose the cut and then the butcher would trim it of most fat and into a clean new hand grinder. Same in France and Italy.

But poultry? Sorry. We had some idiots at a new upscale place in Milano try to sell us thin slices of basically raw duck breast. Ewww Sent that back in a hurry. And even after 3 or 4 episodes of cholera slamanella from bad but well cooked seafood in the Naples area I'll still eat sushi here but only after a really good look around. Those places must be spotless and the fish incredibly fresh.

And hey, there's nothing wrong with veggie burgers!

[dogger]

as someone who produces livestock for sale as meat , i don't care how you cook it .as long as you keep on buying it , you can incinerate it with a flame thrower !! time for me to go and cook 6 or 8 mutton chops [cutlets or ribs ] .
EVERYONE EAT UP .
Dr. Young don't even mention BSE or foot and mouth , if either of them get into Australia i'll have to walk off ..


thank you
dogger
http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[This message was edited by dogger on Sep 06, 2002 at 06:13 AM.]

[Wise Young]

You know, all they have to do is irradiate fresh meat to sterilize it and eliminate the risk of bacterial contamination. People should realize that cooking meat does not eliminate prions (which causes the "mad" cow disease). Prions remain in meat even if you have it "well-done".

In Japan, they have made an art and cult of eating raw fish. Fish is particularly well-suited for this purpose because contaminated fish smells bad and only very fresh fish meat can be used for this purpose.

I personally did not understand the difference between fresh and aged beef until several years ago when I visited Uruguay to give a lecture on spinal cord injury. In Uruguay, they eat beef fresh. I mean, really fresh. They prefer to kill the cattle on the same day as the eating. There is a real difference between fresh and "aged" meat. Fresh meat tastes different and is not mushy. In the United States and Canada, most of the beef is "aged" for days or weeks.

Wise.

[Max]

Medium-Rare Please, And Deliver It to My Cave
Fri Sep 6, 5:06 PM ET
By Serena Gordon
HealthScoutNews Reporter

FRIDAY, Sept. 6 (HealthScoutNews) -- The recent discovery of a 7,700-year-old female thighbone has given scientists new insight into the eating habits of our ancient ancestors.



It appears they didn't even come close to following a balanced diet.

Using stable isotope analysis, researchers from the University of Sheffield and Bradford University in England found the woman ate nearly as much meat as a wolf.

Dubbed the Lady of Trent, the woman's thighbone was found during excavation of a gravel pit in a dried up channel of the River Trent in Staythorpe. Scientists believe the woman lived during the Mesolithic era.

Analysis of nitrogen isotopes in bone measure how much meat was present in a person's diet over a period of several years, and carbon isotopes can be used to measure the amount of marine or land-based food sources in the diet, according to the University of Sheffield archaeologist who found the bone, Glyn Davies.

"For the meat, her nitrogen figure was 9.3. For comparison, a cow would have a figure of about six and a carnivore like a wolf around 10 or more," says Davies. "This suggests that her diet included a lot of meat, but would have included some plants."

Davies says the Lady of Trent ate no marine life, which wasn't surprising because she lived 35 miles from the coast.

The archaeologists also found bones from deer and wild cattle near the woman's thighbone. These animal bones had cut marks on them, suggesting they had been butchered, Davies says.

Of course, just because our ancestors might have eaten this way, it doesn't necessarily mean it's a healthier way to live.

"Our ancestors made due with what they had to eat," says New York University nutritionist Samantha Heller, explaining that other research has found people who lived near the coast ate mostly fish.

Humans live much longer lives now, Heller points out. Our ancestors probably died long before heart disease, diabetes or cancer would have set in, she says. Plus, they were much more physically active than people are today.

Most important, she says, this is only the bone of one woman, and you can't judge the diet of an entire people by one person.

If you want to stay healthy, avoid the Lady of Trent's diet, Heller advises. Eat a mostly plant-based diet with lots of vegetables, legumes and whole grains.

"Don't eat a lot of full-fat animal products. We know that a high consumption of saturated fat and cholesterol greatly increases our risk of heart disease," she adds.

What To Do

To learn more about the Mesolithic period and what people might have eaten back then, visit the University of Leicester or the Chichester District Museum.


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=97&ncid=97&e=10&u=/hsn/20020906/hl_hsn/medium_rare_please__and_deliver_it_to_my_cave

==============================
"Experience teaches that, of all the emotions, fear stands alone in its power to move us, or to capture us in its grip forever. In a world of terrors, there is nothing more fearsome that the unknown...especially when what is unknown is ourselves." Outer Limits(Fear Itself)

[CLC379]

one requirment in rehab was to cook something, turns out Dad was casterating some calves so ask him to bring a few nuts up to rehab. me & a guy from nebraska cooked the fries. my ocupational therapist was going to join us for the meal along with a few other people from rehab. my o/t vomited while we were cutting the nuts up. she left then the bad odor calf fries put off while cooking scared off the rest of the crowd.

we had one of the best calf fry dinners ever.

the next month the hospital cooked calf fries, or rocky mountain oysters they called them. i bit into one it tasted terrible & it was green? i have never seen a green calf nut but all them from rehab my o/t included were bragging about how good the rocky mountain oysters were, heck they think rotten green fries taste good they should have tried fresh ones.

[marmalady]

Thanks for sharing, CLC! I think that even I, cowgirl/cave-woman that I am, would have to stop at rocky mountain oysters!

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Tough times don't last - tough people do.

[monkeygirl]

You have got to be joking. Rare hamburglers one thing but that's down right unbelieveable. If it's true, no offence but you're eating habits are like really, really weird! Do you eat their boobies too? "tender titties" or "barbequed boobies" http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Sue Pendleton]

Dogger, you want to sell more sheep? Sell it tiny! I hate mutton and that's what lamb is here in the US and most of it from you folks. Spring lamb my ass! I finally fell in love with lamb in Italy where a leg feeds 3 if there's a first course. That's 4 months old. Romans specialize in 1 month old lamb. Either one sure tastes so much better than mutton!

And I still have an apron from the Gilroy Garlic festival in California--"10 million coyotes can't be wrong. Eat American lamb!"

[dogger]

CLC we call them ''bush oysters '' here http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif


dogger

[Wise Young]

How many people throw away the chicken gizzards, heads, and feet? It is astonishing to me how much good protein American throw away. Wise.

[marmalady]

Wise, you're so right about the proteins Americans just discard - if you look at dishes from Europe and Asia, every part of the animal is utilized. And at one time in the US, 'offal' dishes were a part of the common diet, but during the late '50's and early '60's, the advent of so many 'convenience' foods turned the home cook away from preparing these and other dishes 'from scratch', and thus began the whole 'convenience cooking' generation.

In Italy and France in particular, dishes of kidney, brain, jowl, etc. are still quite common and a part of the national 'cuisine' of the country.

Maybe we should start a thread on how to eat chicken feet while out at a dim sum restaurant?! http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

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Tough times don't last - tough people do.

[vic]

marmelady: here they say, at the "slaghterhouses", that the only part from a pig they do not process into food, is the scream.. And look at the scotchmen, their national dish is a sheep stommach with all sorts of strange things in, its called haggish. And to be honest, food like lambs liver, and calveshearts in creamy brown sauce is really delicious.

Wise Young: I am happy I have never been served chicken feet, I am sure I would not know how to appreciate it :-)

[Shannon]

This thread is like torture for this vegetarian! Yet I keep coming back. I just can't stay away.

For years and years my dad made fun of my vegetarianism. Then one day he finally agreed to try a veggie burger. Now it's the only kind of burger he eats. It may not taste as good as a regular burger, but it does taste good, and it's much more healthy. AND, a beautiful cow didn't have to die!

Okay, I'm going to go eat my dandelion salad now. (Just kidding)

[marmalady]

Vic, being in the food business, I'm well aware of the dishes you describe! But are they in the mainstream 'food culture'? Not really.

Haggis is tame; how about our Pennsylvania Dutch 'head cheese' - stop it, guys, it's not what you think! Basically it's boiled pig head that gets all jellied up and put in a mold. Sorry, Monkeygirl!

Beaker, I live with two vegetarians - hubbie and son. When I really want to torture them, I make fried chicken; the smell drives 'em nuts!

And getting back to the original topic of rare burger or steak tartar, I find that much less repulsive than the nasty little Mexican habit of fried crickets!

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Tough times don't last - tough people do.

[Wise Young]

marmalady is the most wonderful cook! I can attest to that because she has catered several of our events in the Center.

Vic, you can indeed go to almost any Chinese restaurant that caters to Chinese and serves dim sum, and get chicken's feet and also duck's feet, as well as duck tongues and fish cheeks. Many Chinese believe that chicken's feet contain great nutrients that are therapeutic. I bet that if I did an analysis of chicken's feet, I will find an inordinate amount of glucosamine and other goodies. Also, there are a number of concoctions that Chinese have involving chicken's feet for wound-healing.

Wise.

[vic]

I like this thread, food is something we eat every day, so I believe we should spend lots of time preparing it and ofcourse talking about it and eating it :-).

Marmalady, I do think, that both liver and heart is pretty common around here, you will find it at the supermarket in the cooler, ready to go take home and prepare, although they seldom have lamb, you will need to go to the butcher for that. You can even buy heart in creamed sauce canned, so people only need to open the can and heat it. The dutch head cheese you mention, is a common christmas dish here at our christmas gatherings where we can sit around and eat different dishes for hours, we eat it on black bread with mustard, very tastefull. I could have mentioned the more strange dishes I have heard about, but I dont think you would like hearing about it.

Wise, I trust you, that chickenfeet taste good, I just let my vivid imagination get away with me, so I pictured a plate filled with feet from chicken with toes sticking up evrywhere :-) I once had froglegs in a chineese restaurant - I thought I had ordered fish, so today I am a bit more carefull when ordering.


I really think we could share some interesting recipes on this forum with food from our "national" kitchen, so now i just ask, does anyone have any interesting recipees they would like to share ?

[TD]

Originally posted by Marmalady:


In Italy and France in particular, dishes of kidney, brain, jowl, etc. are still quite common and a part of the national 'cuisine' of the country.

_____________
Tough times don't last - tough people do.

Isn't eating the brain of a cow the way you contract Mad Cow Disease? Thanks anyway but I will just eat the meat.

"And so it begins."

[marmalady]

Wise, Thank you!

TD - Don't know about mad cow - I think it's the whole animal, isn't it? I'm with you, anyway - the thought of eating offal is just awful! http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif

VIC, I don't know where you're from, so can't comment on what local food customs you have. I suspect you're not in the States?! We can get lamb in the grocery stores here, but I have never seen cans of heart in cream sauce!!!

Here in the US, local culture of the area affects what's available in the groceries. Even in my shopping 'radius', there are stores that routinely carry things like smoked pig knuckles, and ears, and snouts, along with collards and fresh black eye peas. Other markets don't have any of that, but do have foise gras, and other 'exotic' items.

I do so agree with your statement that "food is something we eat every day, so I believe we should spend lots of time preparing it and ofcourse talking about it and eating it :-)." Preparing food for yourself and your family is an act of love, and the ritual of sitting down and 'breaking bread' together as a family is a custom that's sadly disappearing.

So, too with the art of cooking; the availability of 'convenice' foods, and 'ready to eat' delis, along with the hectic lifestyle of many Americans, has all contributed to the loss of a 'cooking culture'. Recipes are no longer handed down from generation to generation, and it makes me sad, because all of the knowledge of our grandparents is getting lost in the shuffle of our fast paced lives. I encourage everyone I know to sit down with their elders, and talk about and write down, food customs, and recipes. What a wonderful way to preserve heritage, and custom, and a sense of family!

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Tough times don't last - tough people do.

[-Andrea-]

and just don't eat it. I've been vegetarian for about 4 1/2 years and don't miss meat a bit.

Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds. ~Albert Einstein

[Shannon]

Yay! Another vegetarian!

I've been veggie for about 7 years now and I don't miss meat either. Plus, there are so many fake meats now. There are veggie burgers, fake chicken, tofurkey, to name a few. I had a new one the other day that looks and tastes exactly like shrimp. It's amazing.

A friend was telling me yesterday that her sister just started college at a liberal arts school and the meat eaters are the minority there. I truly believe that it won't be long when there are more vegetarians than meat eaters.