NEW Chairs @ the NY Abilities Expo II.......

[BobMach]

Quikie Q7......
looked at it, didnt like the front caster housings. I can see these getting chipped up and looking bad in no time. They looked out of place on the chair like the welder made a mistake. The rep said there may be a swept back option available but didn't know for sure if this one was it or not. Whats up with company reps not know their product, this was a reoccurring problem during the show. Had the same problem with Colours and a couple others. He was aware of the concerns about the wide housings so i would have assumed one of the 3 chairs would have been optioned that way. Tilted it back, looked it for a few minutes rolled it round then talked to the Sunrise Medical peeps for a sec more to be polite and went on my merry way. Do like their new Jay Ion Cushion and did sit on one, but as with all cushions they feel great when u first sit in on them.

Panthera Carbon Fiber Chair...........
it was light, so light i picked it up with one arm and swung it over my head before i jumped in it and rolled off. Just under 10 lbs. So light it didn't feel real and it felt unsafe like i was rolling around in a plastic wheelchair. It is a "pretty" chair and i dont see it staying pretty long. I dont feel confident where carbon fiber and metal parts meet, how durable will that be over the long run. Dont see the shiny carbon fiber finish holding up well to the ruff riders. Carbon Fiber is strong but is also prone to chipping like fiberglass. Would like to see one after its been rode hard for about 2 years. Here is where im about to start a shit storm so get your rain coats on, i think weight is over rated when it comes to ultra-light wheelchairs. That's right i said it, so release the hounds, call the "Weight Police", when i rode this 10 lb chair i didnt feel an amazing "WOW, this thing is so lite!!!!" sensation. There was no noticeable difference between this Panthera and the other ultra light chairs i test drove on Saturday and i rode a few. No noticeable difference in regards to "Stop, Wait, let me get me checkbook!!!" My Marvel fully loaded with accessories, wallets, etc etc is about 34Lbs and i did not notice a significant difference. Im sure i would have going up a steep incline or through someones grassy yard. On a hard smooth surface it felt like any other NICE ultra-light. Transfer weight is so light your kids could put the chair safely in a trunk. I dont like to break down a chair to drive and I avoid it at all costs but some must and this is where the chair has it benefits. And im sure my girlfriend would prefer to load the Panthera in her trunk opposed to my hefty Marvel. Cool chair but not worth the price tag for us regular riders. A chair for riders that collect wheelchairs like some people collect exotic cars. A niche chair for sure.

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j312/bobmach/102_0111.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j312/bobmach/102_0112.jpg

There is also a new mono frame chair on the market called the Tsunami & the Rogue by Ki Mobility. Nice looking chairs, designed to compete with Quickie, TiLite Aero and Top End. They also have a new Titanium chair the rep was using as his daily ride. Apparently the bend in the down tubes is thicker and heat treated on all their frames making them less prone to bending. All chairs were in use when i first stopped by and planned on going back to ride it but never made it. http://kimobility.com/

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j312/bobmach/rogue.jpg

Got to chat with Pat from FreeWheel, nice fella although pat said the Freewheel wont work on my Marvel. Looks like a cool outdoor accessory to have and will have one some day.
Also chatted with Scott from BikeOn, another nice guy who i will be talking to more in the future.
Invacare has a real nice CF solid back rest called the Matrix, looks like more competition for ADI & Varilite.
Overall it was a great experience and will be back next year BUT i will make sure to get a hotel room and get a 2nd day in. Maybe do shots with Jeff Adams saturday nite in between show days. There were so many more things i wanted to see and questions to ask.

[sherocksandsherolls]

great report..thanks :)

[ReArkou]

great report..thanks :)

Thanks for sharing. I still want to test a Pantera X, but purely for curiosity, I (almost) know already it wont be my suitable chair. It's impressive however looking it (front casters excluded..yak!)

[jschism]

Agree with the weight and handling. I've had this discussion with some others regarding my Icon. It seems much more agile than my ZR, it handles better and is so easy to maneuver, but weighs a lot more. This is what I think, the majority of the weight on the Icon has such a low center of gravity, it helps with the balance of the chair making it handle so well.

[~Lin]

I was waiting for this second part to hear about the panthera! Just for curiousity sake, its not an option. Weight is really important for me because of loading the chair. Ideally though I'd love that robot that loads the chair for you! I have a station wagon and I keep my chair in the back and broken down the least amount possible. Usually I have someone to load it for me but I'm starting to venture out on my own.

Was the inset on the Q7 2 inches? When it is, the caster setting is always the more forward one. There's a thread right now about that and its been discussed a lot. They aren't very clear that if you get 2 inches of inset they will overrule your caster position choice to the more forward/wider one. That seems to be the number one issue with the Q7, it doesn't work for a lot of people. I'm curious though about when I see other chairs where the casters are wider than the rear wheels. I thought that would be worse? But I guess it also depends on how far forward they are, if they're wider but further back you could get closer to things in the front. I haven't run into the issue since I don't transfer the same way as you all with SCI do.

The ki mobility rogue is 7000 series aluminum like the q7, so I'm thinking the heat treatment is the same as well. What they're describing is how they turn it into 7000 series aluminum. Its too difficult to weld, so they make the chair out of 6000 series aluminum and then heat treat it into 7000 series. Allowing them to have a lighter chair since its stronger than 6000, but bypass the difficulty of working with 7000 series.

[chasmengr]

Thanks, Bob !!

[BobMach]

I was waiting for this second part to hear about the panthera! Just for curiousity sake, its not an option. Weight is really important for me because of loading the chair. Ideally though I'd love that robot that loads the chair for you! I have a station wagon and I keep my chair in the back and broken down the least amount possible. Usually I have someone to load it for me but I'm starting to venture out on my own.

Was the inset on the Q7 2 inches? When it is, the caster setting is always the more forward one. There's a thread right now about that and its been discussed a lot. They aren't very clear that if you get 2 inches of inset they will overrule your caster position choice to the more forward/wider one. That seems to be the number one issue with the Q7, it doesn't work for a lot of people. I'm curious though about when I see other chairs where the casters are wider than the rear wheels. I thought that would be worse? But I guess it also depends on how far forward they are, if they're wider but further back you could get closer to things in the front. I haven't run into the issue since I don't transfer the same way as you all with SCI do.

The ki mobility rogue is 7000 series aluminum like the q7, so I'm thinking the heat treatment is the same as well. What they're describing is how they turn it into 7000 series aluminum. Its too difficult to weld, so they make the chair out of 6000 series aluminum and then heat treat it into 7000 series. Allowing them to have a lighter chair since its stronger than 6000, but bypass the difficulty of working with 7000 series.


the Panthera would be a nice to have if money is not a issue. a great chair to leave the house for cruising adventures, shopping trips etc where excessive loading and unloading is necessary. it would be very beneficial for someone who as to break down the chair and pass the chair in front of them into a car. that was my first thought sitting in it, 2nd thought was not so sure this would hold up to a regular thrashing that a daily driver sometimes endures.

i agree with what jschism said, i think great handling and geometry make up for weight.

there seems to be a big Q7 mystery about the caster position on the order forms and with the sales reps for that reason alone i ventured away.

the Kimobility chairs looked alot nicer, i didnt look close enough to see if any of the frame components were held together with riv-nuts ot through and through hardware which is what i prefer. i didnt really give them a close look because they do not currently offer a box frame chair

[~Lin]

it's a shame quickie doesn't clarify things on the q7 order form. They boast about having 2 positions to choose from, with nothing about how caster position one will overrule your choice if you have 2 inches of inset. It needs to be known so people can determine which combination fits their needs, and not end up with a chair different from the specs they chose!

I don't have a lot of inset, only 1 inch and my legs stay touching the frame or resting my knee with my leg draped on the frame. I also transfer differently and have never run into an issue with caster position 2. But I got exactly what I ordered and was expecting with my chair! You need all the info to choose what chair best fits your needs.

[SharonD]

Bob, this is really helpful. We are looking at the Icon (along with 4 other chairs) for my son. Thank you!!!

[Black Alloy]

Interesting opinions on the carbon fiber chairs. The advantages of a well designed and built composite frame go beyond light weight. My carbon fiber tennis chair is no comparison to welded metal alloy frames that I had used previously. Light weight is not a gimmick though, it influences every function the chair performs. Sports chair or everyday chair, lighter is always better. They don't have to cost a fortune either.